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SIR VEYOR
08-07-2014, 08:49 PM
Ok, I don't normally do this because people typically don't actually like advice that goes against their impulses and implies even a minor impact on their instant gratification....

However, I have given these books and ideas to assorted friends and family (mostly 1 through 4). While most have been reluctant, some have slowly started reading, thinking and following some. And some of these aren't that well known in Canada especially.

Now, there are excellent explanations and instructions on precious metals and how\what to invest\plan financially in the future for a rather rapid societal crash or extreme financial hardship. This is no way is an attempt to diminish those outlooks. If nothing else, it should be a solid part of your overall investing framework and assign as much weight to it you feel personally comfortable with.

This following stuff is more for day to day wealth increasing and prepares for a continuation similar to the current state of affairs. I.E. Inflation continues at varying levels of acceleration, and most financial institutions and instruments remain valid. And it doesn't require an aggressive change of income style or lifestyle adjustment (but maybe some).

Please evaluate all sources yourself, mix and match as you desire, and re-evaluate regularly. And as with any Internet based advice, print it out and throw it in the wastebasket and do what you will.

FOR PROFIT, SNAKE OIL, MEDIA USING FINANCIAL CHARLATANS: (sorta)

My personal and subjective ranking:

1. Dave Ramsey - $20 financial workbook available in Canada. Financial Peace series of books. Gets you out of your financial hell using the "debt snowball".
2. Ben Stein and Phil DeMuth - "If you're old enough to have sex, you're old enough to be investing for your retirement". Predominately stock market approach. Monte Carlo testing, enough charts and graphs to keep even the resident "graphist" happy. Several titles, "Supercharge your Portfolio" is more advanced of series.
3. Clark Howard - "Squeeze every penny" Light hearted but useful financial stuff with an emphasis on value. Find out how to make your cheap disposable razor last almost indefinitely.
4. Wealthy Barber - "Pay yourself first" Canadian financial legend. Mostly useful, light intro for lots of people. Made it to Dragons Den, which might be a sign it's jumped the Shark Tank. Fonzie Pun, no Ponzi scheme.
5. Jim Cramer of Mad Money - High energy, hasn't really lost it yet. Put in the work, it can pay off for you. The "bad advice" thing that MSM railed on him with wasn't really all that. Still useful, I feel.
6. Suze Orman - Finances with a more feminine view? Not bad but I felt some stuff was wrong or even dangerous. Make up your own mind.
7. Old Mother Earth News, newer magazine not that impressive
8. The Cheapskate Monthly

1. Dave Ramsey
This guys been on radio for a long time and his gimmick is "baby steps", "rice and beans" and a few other catchy slogans. He's become more mainstream and his show is now more "followers" calling in. However, I was listening to him way back in time. People earning a combined $22,000/yr somehow manage to get outrageoulsy in debt to amounts like $400,000. Awesome entertainment. However, occasional random success stories would call in to thank him for his advice and claimed net worths of upwards of $8 million. So I checked it out and it can be very useful. Workbook and companion book newest I think, and now is running "universities" all over including Canada. This may be your #1 best place to start your financial foundation. Get yourself into a Bugatti Veyron if you want with his advice!

2. Ben Stein and Phil DeMuth
Yes, it's "Bueller" and "win Ben Steins Money" guy. Also featured on Jimmy Kimmel now and then. Read everything they've put out if you can. If you have an employer match or self directed pension plan, and can't move it into physical PMs, worth heavy investigation.

3. Clark Howard
New York area financial guy. Big on saving the money you've got and making it go further. Has some books, even one for children.

4. Wealthy Barber - Get a copy at Value Village and give it to someone. Good intro, help understand concepts and some pitfalls of different ways to invest. Shows some property investment isn't as suitable for some people as other property styles. Addresses different lifestyles and stages of life. And you can keep your mullet.

Please add additional sources to my short listing. I know there's more hidden gems out there, and some real stinkers. Remember, a rising tide lifts all ships!

infidel29
08-09-2014, 01:01 PM
all good stuff! However, I personally dont like suze orman, as i agree with some of your thoughts on her. another one to check out is Canada's Gail Vaz Oxlade, from the series til debt do us part, money moron and princess.

Candychikita
08-10-2014, 08:46 PM
Heh, nothing on here about Rich Dad, Poor Dad series/audio/game? :D

I found his stuff interesting to read, and possibly the reason why so many people went into property in the US that they couldn't afford. But...it was a beginner book to my brother and I about options other than what was harped about for years in our family (get good grades, go to university, get a good job, buy a house) Doesn't really tell you what steps to follow, but ...meh. It's a start

SIR VEYOR
08-10-2014, 10:03 PM
Heh, nothing on here about Rich Dad, Poor Dad series/audio/game? :D

I found his stuff interesting to read, and possibly the reason why so many people went into property in the US that they couldn't afford. But...it was a beginner book to my brother and I about options other than what was harped about for years in our family (get good grades, go to university, get a good job, buy a house) Doesn't really tell you what steps to follow, but ...meh. It's a start
I've read just one or two of his books a while ago. I remember the name but his approach apparently didn't resonate with me at the time. Although, I think the Wealthy barber uses a similar reference of an external affluent source providing guidance to author and barber alike?

There is a lot of stuff out there and it really is a matter of do a lot of research, thinking on the concepts, and then use the parts that fit your mentality and capabilities best. And there are a lot of common themes just packages slightly differently. Whatever makes your lightbulb go off and hopefully get to the point where you can have "fun" with your money. Be it toys, indulging family, or showing others by example what is possible with what is really minimal thought and effort in the long run...

SIR VEYOR
08-10-2014, 10:08 PM
another one to check out is Canada's Gail Vaz Oxlade, from the series til debt do us part, money moron and princess.

I've seen her on TV, does she have anything else out there? Book or on-line things? I'm just partial to more reading than watching for absorbing, processing and thinking on how to apply. Programs keep things a little too "channeled" sometimes for making application to oneself it seems.

She uses jars and Ramsey uses envelopes and there are some other commonalities. It does show that you may have to modify your lifestyle a bit, but the changes are actually fairly minor once you've acclimated to them.

Candychikita
08-11-2014, 10:22 AM
It does show that you may have to modify your lifestyle a bit, but the changes are actually fairly minor once you've acclimated to them.

Yes. A really important thing to do is ...pay your savings first, not with what's 'left over'. There are rarely left overs when it comes to money. Budget it into your life like a bill payment and just do it. Do it, and leave it alone. Whether 'leaving it alone' is shoving it in a jar, a mattress, an envelope or going further with your investment research...that's up to you and your goals. A lot of people these days have no idea how to set aside a nest egg and depend on debt to see them through emergencies which may not be a good thing, when you realize that same debt "safety net" is carrying all those impulse purchases.

If I recall correctly, the Wealthy Barber urged people to save 10% of their earnings. I found this number to be eerily similar to the requests for a 10% tithe to the church, of varying sects and religions. What's with the 10% number?

infidel29
08-11-2014, 02:15 PM
I've seen her on TV, does she have anything else out there? Book or on-line things? I'm just partial to more reading than watching for absorbing, processing and thinking on how to apply. Programs keep things a little too "channeled" sometimes for making application to oneself it seems.

She uses jars and Ramsey uses envelopes and there are some other commonalities. It does show that you may have to modify your lifestyle a bit, but the changes are actually fairly minor once you've acclimated to them.

she has a website and blog: debtfreeforever
she also has MANY books written. a simple goggle search will tell you all you need to know

infidel29
08-11-2014, 02:17 PM
Yes. A really important thing to do is ...pay your savings first, not with what's 'left over'. There are rarely left overs when it comes to money. Budget it into your life like a bill payment and just do it. Do it, and leave it alone. Whether 'leaving it alone' is shoving it in a jar, a mattress, an envelope or going further with your investment research...that's up to you and your goals. A lot of people these days have no idea how to set aside a nest egg and depend on debt to see them through emergencies which may not be a good thing, when you realize that same debt "safety net" is carrying all those impulse purchases.

If I recall correctly, the Wealthy Barber urged people to save 10% of their earnings. I found this number to be eerily similar to the requests for a 10% tithe to the church, of varying sects and religions. What's with the 10% number?

because 10% is a minimal number that MOST frivolous people can adjust to and yet will still yield decent results over a lonnnnngggg period of time, typically the average 40 year drone's working lifespan

SIR VEYOR
08-12-2014, 06:11 PM
because 10% is a minimal number that MOST frivolous people can adjust to and yet will still yield decent results over a lonnnnngggg period of time, typically the average 40 year drone's working lifespan

Well, 10% is easy math (metric even). Works for the medieval farmer who never had access to long division all the way up the spreadsheet master. 10 fingers, 10 equal piles, etc. All these strategies, no matter how awesome; typically need to be easily processed\accepted by the end user to be effective at its intended purpose.

As for the worker drone, hopefully this thread can help more realize just how ineffective and powerless money really is over them. It appears to have great influence over one's life until you reach a certain plateau (different level for all). Then, your mental mindset changes and all things do start becoming possible. And money becomes for all intents and purposes, FUN! You may still be called a drone by some, but it rapidly sounds like sour grapes and falls on deaf ears.

SIR VEYOR
08-12-2014, 06:15 PM
Absolutely not endorsing Lending Tree, but it gives you an idea of how most people really live....

There are ways to actually have it all, and be the exact opposite of these people.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r0HX4a5P8eE

Candychikita
08-13-2014, 01:48 PM
Heh. Did you see the John Oliver episode on predatory lending? It was pretty interesting...American extremes, but we have those payday loan places up here too.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PDylgzybWAw

blacksmithden
08-13-2014, 02:39 PM
Heh. Did you see the John Oliver episode on predatory lending? It was pretty interesting...American extremes, but we have those payday loan places up here too.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PDylgzybWAw

We have those payday loan places on every other corner in Edmonton. Given the state of the economy/ job market, there's no excuse for it. I like what you said about paying your savings first. Very good advice. Im still going to pay the mortgage first though. :)

Candychikita
08-13-2014, 03:22 PM
Cheeky bugger. You know what I mean.

blacksmithden
08-13-2014, 03:25 PM
:) .

I just renewed my mortgage at 2.99 for 5 years. 1% less than.my last renewal. Since im making more money than I was 5 years ago, I cut the amortization period from 12 to 9 years. I could do some investing and make more than 3%, but I like knowing that if interest rates take off, I'll have a substantially lower principal to deal with. If they dont, then maybe I made the wrong choice. I like security over chancing making a few bucks extra.

harbl_the_cat
08-13-2014, 04:03 PM
I really like Robert Kiyosaki's series.

The big thing about his books was putting emphasis on cashflow, not capital appreciation.

People who got greedy during the real estate boom, buying and flipping houses assuming the price would always go up were the ones who got burnt.

People who bought real estate with the intention of generating cash flow off them through rental income, if they were smart about it, did not.

On Pay Day Loans... two words: China Town.

Every store in every China town is a pay day loan shop.

Another reason for anarchy. (I love China Town).

DOA
08-14-2014, 01:44 AM
Yes. A really important thing to do is ...pay your savings first, not with what's 'left over'. There are rarely left overs when it comes to money. Budget it into your life like a bill payment and just do it. Do it, and leave it alone. Whether 'leaving it alone' is shoving it in a jar, a mattress, an envelope or going further with your investment research...that's up to you and your goals. A lot of people these days have no idea how to set aside a nest egg and depend on debt to see them through emergencies which may not be a good thing, when you realize that same debt "safety net" is carrying all those impulse purchases.

If I recall correctly, the Wealthy Barber urged people to save 10% of their earnings. I found this number to be eerily similar to the requests for a 10% tithe to the church, of varying sects and religions. What's with the 10% number?

Paying yourself first is the most important strategy that is also the least followed. So many people have a false sense of security in focusing on only paying down debt (which is important) but if you have nothing put away and something happens to your income, then what? More debt or down the path of creditors. Then there's the power of compound interest working for you instead of against you. Too many people believe that they will have more to put away after the debt is gone but so few ever actually even get to that point. Investing 10% takes advantage of time while creating the habit of paying yourself first. As mentioned, after a while people don't miss the 10% that could never be found before they started the habit.

I'm not sure where the 10% actually came from. Maybe just an easy number to start. It's unbelievable though, how many people are tithing 10%, not paying themselves at all, and falling behind each month. Hope someone looks after them down the road...

For the rest of you, please start somewhere, pay yourself first.

Candychikita
08-14-2014, 01:58 PM
Harbl, I liked the Kiyosaki books because it opened to my eyes about liabilities masquerading as assets...but I found he lost a lot of his audience when he started talking stocks and stock options. Real estate is more tangible to most. I totally have the Cashflow game btw...I think it's great. I think it's interesting watching people who make lots of money in real life never make it out of the "Rat Race". They get really frustrated and I honestly wonder what their personal finances are actually like, when the options for what you can get yourself in debt for are unlimited.

The Rich Dad, Poor Dad books started my personal quest for more information on trading and investing, I figure they did their job as a springboard. My dad is a Poor Dad. He gets really pissed when you call him this bahahahhahahaha. It's not about how much you make in an hourly wage dad...


For the rest of you, please start somewhere, pay yourself first.

I swear there is a direct correlation between nest egg and stress levels. DOA, if I recall you are financial advisor? I'd be interested in knowing if you have personally noticed stress levels in clients going down in proportion the length of time they have been putting money aside. Health is wealth?

harbl_the_cat
08-14-2014, 04:05 PM
I really need to buy the Cashflow game...

Thing about Kiyosaki (more from one of his later books, I think called "Rich Dad's Prophecy") is where he stresses the importance of not investing in anything you haven't personally educated yourself about.

Anything can be an investment - baseball cards, guns, stocks, real estate, precious metals - but it's not the investment that makes a person rich, it's their personal education about that asset class that does.

That's one of the reasons I invest heavily in real estate, precious metals and crypto currency - because they are things I find interesting, which I don't mind educating myself about.

I think stocks are boring personally - and I find it hard to read about investing in them, educating myself about the nuances of the stock market (which is why I don't invest in them).

DOA
08-14-2014, 04:20 PM
I see 3 main financial causes of stress, not having enough, losing what you have, living longer than the funds.

There's definitely less stress among those that have a nest egg. Whether it's just a small emergency fund, knowing they'll get by when something happens; or a retirement portfolio, knowing there's an end to slaving away. People with a plan have less stress.

There's always those without that seem stress free but that's usually due to the ignorance of what life will be like for them when they need funds but don't have enough. I've had many couples tell me their marriage was saved by restructuring and putting a program in place. Makes sense when you consider that the number one thing couples argue about is money and a plan would require them to be on the same page.

SIR VEYOR
08-14-2014, 09:24 PM
I see 3 main financial causes of stress, not having enough, losing what you have, living longer than the funds.


And I've personally found that the Dave Ramsey concepts seemed to do the most for the first, and Ben Stein covers the last. The middle? They all do the cautionary tales, and most go with the 3-6 month expense reserves.

SIR VEYOR
08-14-2014, 09:32 PM
:) .
I just renewed my mortgage at 2.99 for 5 years. 1% less than.my last renewal. Since im making more money than I was 5 years ago, I cut the amortization period from 12 to 9 years. I could do some investing and make more than 3%, but I like knowing that if interest rates take off, I'll have a substantially lower principal to deal with. If they dont, then maybe I made the wrong choice. I like security over chancing making a few bucks extra.

Very nice.
Now if your mortgage has the "double down" option directly against the principal, is it being maxed out?
And how many people actually use the once yearly 10% of loan directly against the principal option?
And the "any amount directly against the principal goes" when the renegotiation window is open?

I went a slightly different route of leaving the amortization alone, but making the "double down" essentially part of my mortgage payment mentally. And then just a stable savings account that also has a direct deposit\transfer from the main fund account at the same time. I think it comes out very similar to your approach, but there might be a small edge of principal over interest in this manner. And if you're looking at longer term mortgages (20-25yr range) it might be a substantial difference.

SIR VEYOR
06-12-2016, 09:34 PM
Just bumping a thread back from the dead. The themes are useful still although bumping it a year ago probably would have been better...

FlyingHigh
06-13-2016, 08:19 AM
I'm currently in the process of basically starting over financially. The POS Ford is on the market and I'm shopping for an older used truck. My savings have been wiped out and I'll have to start rebuilding them. Work is so unstable right now that it's difficult to make many plans. I may be off work all week here, then flat out next week...but no overtime no matter how busy we get. If this lull lasts more than a week I'll be looking for a second job.

Once I get my savings built up again, I'm looking into index fund investing. www.canadiancouchpotato.com has proven to be a very interesting read. A friend of mine follows this method and has done well.

SIR VEYOR
06-14-2016, 05:43 AM
I'm currently in the process of basically starting over financially. The POS Ford is on the market and I'm shopping for an older used truck. My savings have been wiped out and I'll have to start rebuilding them. Work is so unstable right now that it's difficult to make many plans. I may be off work all week here, then flat out next week...but no overtime no matter how busy we get. If this lull lasts more than a week I'll be looking for a second job.

Once I get my savings built up again, I'm looking into index fund investing. www.canadiancouchpotato.com has proven to be a very interesting read. A friend of mine follows this method and has done well.

Id recommend dropping the $20ish for the Ramsey workbook. It's for about where you're at now. And he has a method for dealing with vehicles that you might find useful. It'll let you wind up with a Unimog or something more reliable than your Ford.

FlyingHigh
06-14-2016, 10:52 AM
I'll have a look at it. I think my brother uses Ramsey's system. Once my POS Ford sells, I'll be virtually debt free (well under $10,000) and if work gets steady again I'll be able to start getting ahead. I won't be raking in the cash thanks to lack of overtime, but my expenses will be well under 50% of my income. The plan is as such:

1. Pay off the sub $10,000 truck I'll be buying to replace the POS Ford

2. Re-pay the $10,000 I pulled from savings to get myself in a position to recover from buying the POS Ford

3. Build a $10,000 emergency fund

4. Begin 3 monthly contributions: home downpayment fund, new truck fund, boat fund (The truck and boat may seem silly to some but to me, outside of a satisfying career, my 4 biggest goals in life are to own a house, a nice truck, a good boat and have the freedom and stability to enjoy all 3. All three allow me to pursue the passions that keep me sane. If I achieve those, I'll die happy.)

5. Begin investing in my retirement, as I don't intend to be one of those poor shmucks who works until he physically can't, lingers a bit, then dies. My dad just retired at 55 years old, and I see how much he's loving life. That's my end goal.

Gonna be some toy sparse years ahead, probably end up selling a few, but it'll all pay off in the end. Life is a marathon, so play the long game.

BruceW
06-16-2016, 07:46 AM
Always be on the lookout for small opportunities. For eg yrs ago truck campers were all the rage. In the fall I'd buy a couple rough looking ones that the fridge/stove worked in, pretty them up, about 4 coats of wax on the outside and sell them the first nice spring long weekend at a tidy profit; little things like that. There's always opportunities to pick up a little extra if you keep your eyes open. Doesn't sound like much but it adds up and over the years makes a Huge difference.

Everyone's situation is different, we never had a large income so never had a lot of extra disposable income for things like rsp's. Instead we built up income generating assets and in addition to our primary business Always had at least 3 other irons in the fire, plus always on the lookout for those small opportunites.

pitw
06-16-2016, 09:01 AM
Always be on the lookout for small opportunities. For eg yrs ago truck campers were all the rage. In the fall I'd buy a couple rough looking ones that the fridge/stove worked in, pretty them up, about 4 coats of wax on the outside and sell them the first nice spring long weekend at a tidy profit; little things like that. There's always opportunities to pick up a little extra if you keep your eyes open. Doesn't sound like much but it adds up and over the years makes a Huge difference.

Everyone's situation is different, we never had a large income so never had a lot of extra disposable income for things like rsp's. Instead we built up income generating assets and in addition to our primary business Always had at least 3 other irons in the fire, plus always on the lookout for those small opportunites.

Good job. If I see something I believe I can make money on with a flip it gets done.

SIR VEYOR
06-16-2016, 09:46 AM
While feasting on a deer is great, never pass on a rabbit either. A few rabbits equal a deer pretty fast.

harbl_the_cat
06-16-2016, 02:29 PM
Always be on the lookout for small opportunities. For eg yrs ago truck campers were all the rage. In the fall I'd buy a couple rough looking ones that the fridge/stove worked in, pretty them up, about 4 coats of wax on the outside and sell them the first nice spring long weekend at a tidy profit; little things like that. There's always opportunities to pick up a little extra if you keep your eyes open. Doesn't sound like much but it adds up and over the years makes a Huge difference.

Everyone's situation is different, we never had a large income so never had a lot of extra disposable income for things like rsp's. Instead we built up income generating assets and in addition to our primary business Always had at least 3 other irons in the fire, plus always on the lookout for those small opportunites.

This is great advice, but topping it up, it's important not to fall into such a sense of despair over your circumstances that you become blinded to opportunities that are starring you right in the face.

One of the frustrations I see among many of the Alberta separatists is that the conventional economy has tanked and lots of decent, hard working people simply can't find opportunities to trade time for dollars.

That said, in the time we live in, the world's largest travel and hospitality company (airBNB) owns absolutely no real estate assets. The world's largest carpooling company (Uber) owns absolutely no vehicles.

Now, more than anytime before, there are more opportunities to exchange value, faster, to more people, with practically no capital outlays or assets to do it.

My wife and I are busier than we've ever been and we're doing very well for ourselves, simply because our focus is on finding new, innovative ways to provide value to other people.

Knowledge is power.

Information is packaged, transmittable knowledge.

Everyone has knowledge someone else needs.

Exchanging something you have with someone who needs it is the basis of commerce and finding out how to provide the most high valued knowledge to the people who need it the most and then to monetize the transactions is the underlying principle behind building and securing your financial future in this new economy.

Everything else is gambling.

In the Information Age we live in, there have never been so many opportunities package your knowledge into useful information, transmit it to people who need it, and to monetize the transactions.

SIR VEYOR
04-18-2017, 03:09 PM
American Tax Day!

Time for necrothread revival!

And it seems like some/most people here should have a gander, especially the first several posts. Best $20 you can invest is there too.

blacksmithden
04-18-2017, 07:18 PM
I started doing the "pay yourself" thing a few years ago. I started off with $250 of every pay went straight into invested savings. I upped it to $300 a couple of years ago. I was hoping to up it to $400 this year, but with our endless zero % increase contract, it just isn't happening right now. I'm still a firm believer in getting out of debt as quickly as you can, even if your interest rates are at all time lows. The mortgage has got to go, and the sooner the better.

SIR VEYOR
10-27-2017, 04:51 AM
Time for necrothread revival!

And it seems like some/most people here should have a gander, especially the first several posts.

Best $20 you can invest in yourself is there too.

Get this bumped before busy holiday buying season and Black Thursday, Cyber Wednesday, Small business Saturday, etc start convincing you to make "wants" into "needs".

And if it's been a years since reading some of this stuff, maybe your life has changed enough that a re-read will bring new meanings and outlooks.

For example, at least two members have made significant house/property changes, and several have started side businesses that have become primary since the first post. Big milestones that should be observed. And a few members who have unfortunately reached lower fiscal points since back then. For them, please see #1.

blacksmithden
10-27-2017, 06:45 AM
Get this bumped before busy holiday buying season and Black Thursday, Cyber Wednesday, Small business Saturday, etc start convincing you to make "wants" into "needs".

And if it's been a years since reading some of this stuff, maybe your life has changed enough that a re-read will bring new meanings and outlooks.

For example, at least two members have made significant house/property changes, and several have started side businesses that have become primary since the first post. Big milestones that should be observed. And a few members who have unfortunately reached lower fiscal points since back then. For them, please see #1.

Agreed.

I have a question about capital gains tax. Last November, I ventured into the stock market for the first time. I've been paid a few dividends that will total around 3.75% of the share prices and share price itself as of right now is up about 14%. I have no intention of selling the actual stock, but the dividends were paid into the bank account that holds the shares (for lack of a better way to put it). I just used the dividends to buy more shares. This stock buying/selling account is not sheltered in any way.

Now, I briefly read that contrary to popular belief, capital gains tax is not a 50% flat tax. I think I read that they tax you at the same rate as you're paying income tax on, but only on half of whatever you made ? Is that correct ? Do I only have to pay tax on 50% of the dividend that they've paid me, or do I have to figure out how much the share prices have gone up since last year and pay the tax on that as well ?

TheCenturion
10-27-2017, 07:08 AM
I'll recommend a piece of budgeting software called 'You Need A Budget.' Go through their training webinars, but the basic idea is that you define all of your outflows, then when you get paid, you tell the software that you got paid, and start allocating dollars to the various budget categories. Then, when you spend money, you spend according to the budget, not according to your bank balance.

It's a digital version of the old 'label a bunch of envelopes and stick cash in them' model. I'm not doing the greatest job explaining it, but it's a very good piece of software. Most 'budget' software like Quicken, Moneydance, the old Microsoft Money, and so on, tracks spending, but doesn't allocate spending.

SIR VEYOR
10-28-2017, 05:45 AM
Agreed.

I have a question about capital gains tax. Last November, I ventured into the stock market for the first time. I've been paid a few dividends that will total around 3.75% of the share prices and share price itself as of right now is up about 14%. I have no intention of selling the actual stock, but the dividends were paid into the bank account that holds the shares (for lack of a better way to put it). I just used the dividends to buy more shares. This stock buying/selling account is not sheltered in any way.

Now, I briefly read that contrary to popular belief, capital gains tax is not a 50% flat tax. I think I read that they tax you at the same rate as you're paying income tax on, but only on half of whatever you made ? Is that correct ? Do I only have to pay tax on 50% of the dividend that they've paid me, or do I have to figure out how much the share prices have gone up since last year and pay the tax on that as well ?

I would have to suggest now is the time to sit down with a very good accounting firm. It May not seem cheap by the invoice. But, especially if they go over your last few years finances and discuss what you may want to do moving forward, the results typically pay that invoice and then some. Use them every couple years instead of every year if you're really paranoid about costs. Multiple years cost about the same as a single year to get processed.

I used a very good one in Edmonton if you'd like to know. But I suspect you already have a good one. :cool1: But I did like the bound reports they include over the one page printout from poor ones.

To help maximize your stock playing, I'd also recommend Ben Stiens "Supercharge your Portfolio". It is one of the most advanced of his books oks, but should do you well. Others should start reading his earlier works first, and not even bother with this one for a couple years.

RangeBob
10-28-2017, 06:15 AM
Now, I briefly read that contrary to popular belief, capital gains tax is not a 50% flat tax. I think I read that they tax you at the same rate as you're paying income tax on, but only on half of whatever you made ? Is that correct ?
That sounds correct.


Do I only have to pay tax on 50% of the dividend that they've paid me, or do I have to figure out how much the share prices have gone up since last year and pay the tax on that as well ?

Interest (e.g. bank interest) is taxed as if it were income.

Capital Gains only happen the year you sell shares. If you never sell your shares, you never pay tax on them. The idea is that the gain doesn't happen until it's realized, and it's realized when you sell it. So unless you sell the shares, ignore how much the share prices have changed because it's irrelevant. When you do sell the shares, the difference between the purchase price and the sale price is the capital gain. You pay tax on the entire capital gain in the year you sell the shares, it's not averaged over the years you held the stock.

Dividends are more complex. And there are "eligible dividends" for which the calculation is different. Like interest, dividends are calculated the year they are received. There's a "gross up" calculation, followed by a "credit" calculation, and the tax you pay is the difference between them. Sorry, I don't know enough about dividends to say more than that.

Booletsnotreactwell
10-29-2017, 02:08 PM
Some rules I live by... We'll see if it works out some day.


You'll never make money with no money, we'll you can but it's even harder. The more money you have the easier and more money you will make.

The bullshit the bank/some investment company tells you about $100 a month and eventually it'll end up into $XXX,XXX, not happening. There's ways to make money with nothing, leveraging the shit out of yourself and/or using other peoples money this works if you don't give a shit and are willing to lose it all.

The quick and dirty way to amass massive funds...

If you don't care about being evicted, losing your house, losing all your physical assets (car, nice shit, etc), so basically a single male with nothing to lose, leverage the shit out of yourself with the bank in every way possible and use those funds on something, possibly a 1%'er position, more on that bellow.

Or slowly build up your own free and clear capital and throw it on a 1%'er proposition.

You don't make money with a 99%'er position, 99% of us will never be anything, you'll just be a some guy. To get substantial wealth you gotta be willing to take a 1%'er stance or at the very least a 10%'er stance.

That means doing the exact opposite of what everybody else is doing, that means risks in other words. Notice how everybody is financially fk'ed, that's the 99%, doing the 99%'er stuff. Stupid overpriced house they call an "investment", doing the auto-pilot investment the banks have them setup on, etc...

You won't get to an exceptional life living a normal life. Go live in a trailer park, stack bills sky high and then start buying up some real assets, large chunks of blue chip companies, property free and clear, go to your local startup community and start to eye out some ideas that have real worth, maybe go fund something, throw 10g's at a solid new tech startup. Yea big risks, 1%'er stuff, big failures and big rewards if it works.

You don't get something for nothing in this world. That "safe" investment your bank is selling you, you're not putting up any real capital and you're not taking any risks, you're essentially giving them nothing, you're not going to get anything real in return. 10 g's of your own money on something, that's risks, that's big money, that's something, you can get something for that.


The money shuffling industry, if you don't have substantial money the markets aren't going to do shit for you. The big investment banks, firms, pension funds, they have millions in relatively safe blue chip stocks, they're not volatile, nothing miraculous or spectacular, 3-5% yields but when you have millions 3% starts adding up to substantial money.

Your $5000 that took you three years to save up for, your not getting shit. Takes money to make money... Those big firms, they're investing something into something. Your $5000, your investing nothing into something.

Wanna throw it on some speculative penny stock or some other bullshit, sure for the 1:10,000 chance that it'll work. Investing something for nothing... It just might but it likely wont. At that point you're gambling and while there are people who in the lottery, we'll you get the idea.

You need to have something and you need to be investing in something. Until you have both, it's gambling and it won't work.

You need to be able to understand real value, see real value, and right now that's gonna be against the mainstream point of view.

That million dollar house in Toronto, that's $750,000 of nothing. That's $250,000 of actual "real" value, the rest is an illusion. Money can be made off peoples illusions, timing it is what it's about.


To make money, you gotta make something of worth, see things of actual worth, you have to risk things of worth, you gotta out smart people, be bigger, faster stronger and at the end of the day lucky. Without the stars aligning and a bit of luck, Bill Gates wouldn't be anything.

firemachine69
10-29-2017, 05:21 PM
Some rules I live by... We'll see if it works out some day.


You'll never make money with no money, we'll you can but it's even harder. The more money you have the easier and more money you will make.

The bullshit the bank/some investment company tells you about $100 a month and eventually it'll end up into $XXX,XXX, not happening. There's ways to make money with nothing, leveraging the shit out of yourself and/or using other peoples money this works if you don't give a shit and are willing to lose it all.

The quick and dirty way to amass massive funds...

If you don't care about being evicted, losing your house, losing all your physical assets (car, nice shit, etc), so basically a single male with nothing to lose, leverage the shit out of yourself with the bank in every way possible and use those funds on something, possibly a 1%'er position, more on that bellow.

Or slowly build up your own free and clear capital and throw it on a 1%'er proposition.

You don't make money with a 99%'er position, 99% of us will never be anything, you'll just be a some guy. To get substantial wealth you gotta be willing to take a 1%'er stance or at the very least a 10%'er stance.

That means doing the exact opposite of what everybody else is doing, that means risks in other words. Notice how everybody is financially fk'ed, that's the 99%, doing the 99%'er stuff. Stupid overpriced house they call an "investment", doing the auto-pilot investment the banks have them setup on, etc...

You won't get to an exceptional life living a normal life. Go live in a trailer park, stack bills sky high and then start buying up some real assets, large chunks of blue chip companies, property free and clear, go to your local startup community and start to eye out some ideas that have real worth, maybe go fund something, throw 10g's at a solid new tech startup. Yea big risks, 1%'er stuff, big failures and big rewards if it works.

You don't get something for nothing in this world. That "safe" investment your bank is selling you, you're not putting up any real capital and you're not taking any risks, you're essentially giving them nothing, you're not going to get anything real in return. 10 g's of your own money on something, that's risks, that's big money, that's something, you can get something for that.


The money shuffling industry, if you don't have substantial money the markets aren't going to do shit for you. The big investment banks, firms, pension funds, they have millions in relatively safe blue chip stocks, they're not volatile, nothing miraculous or spectacular, 3-5% yields but when you have millions 3% starts adding up to substantial money.

Your $5000 that took you three years to save up for, your not getting shit. Takes money to make money... Those big firms, they're investing something into something. Your $5000, your investing nothing into something.

Wanna throw it on some speculative penny stock or some other bullshit, sure for the 1:10,000 chance that it'll work. Investing something for nothing... It just might but it likely wont. At that point you're gambling and while there are people who in the lottery, we'll you get the idea.

You need to have something and you need to be investing in something. Until you have both, it's gambling and it won't work.

You need to be able to understand real value, see real value, and right now that's gonna be against the mainstream point of view.

That million dollar house in Toronto, that's $750,000 of nothing. That's $250,000 of actual "real" value, the rest is an illusion. Money can be made off peoples illusions, timing it is what it's about.


To make money, you gotta make something of worth, see things of actual worth, you have to risk things of worth, you gotta out smart people, be bigger, faster stronger and at the end of the day lucky. Without the stars aligning and a bit of luck, Bill Gates wouldn't be anything.


I bought a tractor. Capital investment.

You're right. No one ever got rich "working for the man".

SIR VEYOR
10-30-2017, 05:12 PM
Some rules I live by... We'll see if it works out some day.


I'd have to say #3, and maybe #8 would really work with that plan. And not many people here could likely implement it.

Booletsnotreactwell
11-01-2017, 11:44 AM
I'd have to say #3, and maybe #8 would really work with that plan. And not many people here could likely implement it.


What do you mean?

SIR VEYOR
11-02-2017, 06:07 AM
I'd have to say #3, and maybe #8 would really work with that plan. And not many people here could likely implement it.


What do you mean?

See post 1 for listing

Booletsnotreactwell
11-03-2017, 12:04 PM
So book #3 & #8?

Candychikita
11-04-2017, 10:49 AM
You were right about YNAB videos being interesting. Been using this program for about 8 months and it's pretty good (when the website works)

One thing I have noticed with myself and other females is emotion spending. "Retail therapy" is very very prevalent for overworked females (possibly even males...sorry, have been canvassing females only right now). Instead of thinking about the purchases logically, there is a "I need to treat myself" thought process. Instead of doing something that rests and relaxes and creates peace, they shop. Lower stress and exhaustion levels, less emotion spending. It's a bit counter productive, as the emotion spending can put you in debt, which means you need to bring in more money, which causes more stress...the emotion spending cycle begins again. From what I've observed, women with a fulfilling outlet for stress relief spends less on random crap.

Food for thought on spending patterns?

Swampdonkey
11-04-2017, 12:06 PM
I remember doing some of that when I first started oilfield work. Spend winter frozen and lonely, come back to a nice five figures in the bank. I had to convince myself it was worth it somehow, and rather than finding a whore to bleed me dry, I bought rifles that I really didn't need. I was especially careful to stay clear of women and drugs, and I knew trucks were a depreciating asset, but guns had a kind of moral superiority to them, and implied the fantasy that I might actually use them well.

As for financial planning, I try to stay as close to zero as possible for what's on the books. We're on track to have the house paid off before any kids graduate high school or before it needs a new roof, and I buy an ounce of gold here and there when I can sneak it in.

It's been hard as a husband to prepare for retirement, or really for anything. My wife doesn't think long-term like I do, and it's hard to convince her that we need to load up our TFSAs for posterity.

infidel29
11-05-2017, 01:26 AM
One thing I've noted about women is they all have what I call a "security gland". (My term). When women don't feel financially/emotionally/physically secure their gland starts acting up and they get emotionally stressed. Play on this. Tell them they'll feel more secure and sleep better at night with an emergency fund and money in the bank. It does work. And Candychikita is spot on with her assessment of emotion spending. Dave Ramsey has mentioned in the past that all finance is 20% knowledge and 80% behavior. Change your attitude towards money and you can't help but succeed.

Candychikita
11-06-2017, 09:29 PM
Security gland heh. That works.

Food security is on that list as well - the whole "bachelor fridge" with a shelf of condiments and another one of beer can cause a female glitch bahaha. You find a keeper, put food in your fridge before you bring her home!

SIR VEYOR
11-13-2017, 07:09 AM
For boolets financial preparedness plans, and cause it showed up in another thread:

https://earlyinvesting.com/research/private-opportunities/?code=X310T417&gclid=CjwKCAiAoqXQBRA8EiwAIIOWspNWey7bv5sqIoDX9rjU WF5egC-Zxyn0l7lxgChG-NN8vSxudaBtpBoCSSYQAvD_BwE

No idea on what it is, just google go me to that link looking for your email addy...