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View Full Version : Bill C42 - Province not Territory?



RangeBob
01-04-2015, 03:29 PM
Couple of weeks ago, I emailed liberal MP Wayne Easter, I called him out on his lies and misinformation regarding Bil C42. His response:

"I know it is hard for you to see the truth but JT's position, as is my own is based on the reality of the transportation provisions in the Bill. As well, you will note from my remarks that the efficiency provisions of the Bill we can accept however the government does not want to split the Bill to streamline those areas.
As a last point you should note that the North: Yukon, NWT, and Nunavut ‎is not covered by the new provisions so falls under the old law."

The "Yukon, NWT, and Nunavut" bit I'll have to look into, to discover if it's "province" or "provincial CFO" in Bill C-42. That seems precisely the sort of thing that a committee may fix the wording of, within the intent of the bill to make the ATT the same Canada wide.

The "efficiency provisions" are the ATT, but that's what he wants to get rid of. The parts he wanted to 'split' and then streamline the passing of were the additional restrictions, not the efficiency provisions.

The "reality of the transportation provisions in the Bill" -- I recall they presented all the border crossings as possible destinations, ignoring that the Bill requires that the person have corresponding paperwork to enter the country in question. And of course that we had those abilities for years until quite recently, and non-restricted (aka "bad scary guns") can be carried just like that.

RangeBob
01-04-2015, 03:29 PM
The "Yukon, NWT, and Nunavut" bit I'll have to look into, to discover if it's "province" or "provincial CFO" in Bill C-42. That seems precisely the sort of thing that a committee may fix the wording of, within the intent of the bill to make the ATT the same Canada wide.

I note that the existing Firearms Act says things like


Clause 4: (1) to (3) Existing text of subsection 7(1):
7. (1) An individual is eligible to hold a licence only if the individual
(a) successfully completes the Canadian Firearms Safety Course, as given by an instructor who is designated by a chief firearms officer, and passes the tests, as administered by an instructor who is designated by a chief firearms officer, that form part of that Course;
(b) except in the case of an individual who is less than eighteen years old, passes the tests, as administered by an instructor who is designated by a chief firearms officer, that form part of that Course;
(c) successfully completed, before January 1, 1995, a course that the attorney general of the province in which the course was given had, during the period beginning on January 1, 1993 and ending on December 31, 1994, approved for the purposes of section 106 of the former Act; or
(d) passed, before January 1, 1995, a test that the attorney general of the province in which the test was administered had, during the period beginning on January 1, 1993 and ending on December 31, 1994, approved for the purposes of section 106 of the former Act.


and I don't think anyone is claiming that people in Yukon, NWT, and Nunavut don't have to take a course.


“provincial minister” means
(a) in respect of a province, the member of the executive council of the province who is designated by the lieutenant governor in council of the province as the provincial minister,
(b) in respect of a territory, the federal Minister, or
(c) in respect of any matter for which there is no provincial minister under paragraph (a) or (b), the federal Minister;


“Attorney General”
(a) subject to paragraphs (b.1) to (g), with respect to proceedings to which this Act applies, means the Attorney General or Solicitor General of the province in which those proceedings are taken and includes his or her lawful deputy,
(b) with respect to the Yukon Territory, the Northwest Territories and Nunavut, or with respect to proceedings commenced at the instance of the Government of Canada and conducted by or on behalf of that Government in respect of a contravention of, a conspiracy or attempt to contravene, or counselling the contravention of, any Act of Parliament other than this Act or any regulation made under such an Act, means the Attorney General of Canada and includes his or her lawful deputy,


6. Subsection 19(2) of the Act is replaced by the following:

(1.1) In the case of an authorization to transport issued for a reason referred to in paragraph (1)(a) within the province where the holder of the authorization resides, the specified places must include all shooting clubs and shooting ranges that are approved under section 29 and that are located in that province.
(2) Despite subsection (1), an individual must not be authorized to transport a prohibited firearm, other than a handgun referred to in subsection 12(6.1), between specified places except for the purposes referred to in paragraph (1)(b).
(2.1) Subject to subsection (2.3), an individ#ual who holds a licence authorizing the individual to possess prohibited firearms or restricted firearms must, if the licence is renewed, be authorized to transport them within the individual’s province of residence
(a) to and from all shooting clubs and shooting ranges that are approved under section 29;
(b) to and from any place a peace officer, firearms officer or chief firearms officer is located, for verification, registration or disposal in accordance with this Act or Part III of the Criminal Code;
(c) to and from a business that holds a licence authorizing it to repair or appraise prohibited firearms or restricted firearms;
(d) to and from a gun show; and
(e) to a port of exit in order to take them outside Canada, and from a port of entry.

(2.2) Subject to subsection (2.3), if a chief firearms officer has authorized the transfer of a prohibited firearm or a restricted firearm to an individual who holds a licence authorizing the individual to possess prohibited firearms or restricted firearms, the individual must be authorized
(a) to transport the firearm within the individual’s province of residence from the place where the individual acquires it to the place where they may possess it under section 17; and
(b) to transport their prohibited firearms and restricted firearms within the individual’s province of residence to and from the places referred to in any of paragraphs (2.1)(a) to (e).

12. (1) Section 58 of the Act is amended by adding the following after subsection (1):
(1.1) However, a chief firearms officer’s power to attach a condition to a licence, an authorization to carry or an authorization to transport is subject to the regulations.

-- http://www.parl.gc.ca/HousePublications/Publication.aspx?Language=E&Mode=1&DocId=6719328&File=4

Zinilin
01-04-2015, 04:10 PM
Debates of the Senate (Hansard)
2nd Session, 36th Parliament, Volume 138, Issue 70
Wednesday, June 21, 2000 The Honourable Gildas L. Molgat, Speaker
---
Serge Joyal - Liberal Party of Canada
Province: Quebec
Senatorial Designation: Kennebec
Appointed on the advice of: Chrétien (Lib.)
---
Joan Fraser - Liberal Party of Canada
Province: Quebec
Senatorial Designation: De Lorimier
Appointed on the advice of: Chrétien (Lib.)
---
Senator Joyal: The definition of province includes territories.

Senator Fraser: Plus territories. As Senator Joyal reminds me, the legal definition of province includes territories. We were at pains to have witnesses come from portions of Canada outside Quebec. One or two of them raised the question, in specific terms, about other provinces. We did not explore it in great detail, but we were all conscious that we were not talking only about Quebec. In fact, we did debate that point at some length. In my view, what this bill does is protect all citizens of any province from a secession that could happen by accident, but it also protects their rights, should a majority of the people of that province or territory ever decide that they wish to leave Canada. I think it is ultimately useful should —

RangeBob
01-04-2015, 04:40 PM
the legal definition of province includes territories
I went looking for that through the Criminal Code and Firearms Act, but didn't find it.
Perhaps some other Act.

RangeBob
01-04-2015, 09:47 PM
"province" means a province of Canada, and includes Yukon, the Northwest Territories and Nunavut;
-- Interpretation Act, http://laws.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts/i-21/

blacksmithden
01-04-2015, 10:00 PM
Now mail that back to him, and inform him that if he's not willing to learn the laws of the land before preaching about them, then he should resign because he's not qualified for the job.

ALSO...thanks for taking the time to out the rat Bob.

Foxer
01-05-2015, 09:23 AM
Wayne easter has been and always will be a useless twit. He's always pulled this type of crap. He was solicitor general when the LGR really came into effect in 2002-3 and his comments then were equally stupid. Lets just think about that for a second - the EX SOLICITOR GENERAL of Canada doesn't know that territories are included in the definition of province.

This is the kind of crap we'll face if the libs get in next election.

RangeBob
01-05-2015, 09:35 AM
Easter doubled down...

I replied to liberal MP Wayne Easter and confronted him on this, his reply;

Sorry about that. Comments weren't meant to be insulting but on reread they come across that way. You are welcome to your view for sure. On the facts, the way the bill is written, operationally transportation provisions I believe will creat problems. And as expressed on the North the Bill creats very different gun laws within the country. Whether that was intended or was a mistake on the part of government, they are not saying. We will see if they allow ammendments or bring some in.
WE


_____________
double down:
to become more tenacious, zealous, or resolute in a position or undertaking <the administration needs to double down on the call for political reform>

Foxer
01-05-2015, 10:34 AM
Easter doubled down...



_____________
double down:
to become more tenacious, zealous, or resolute in a position or undertaking <the administration needs to double down on the call for political reform>
If you're going to go stupid, go BIG stupid.

Edenchef
01-05-2015, 11:51 AM
If you're going to go stupid, go BIG stupid.

Well, that is the Liberal way. Remember to them we are all mere Plebes.

Cheers!

Gaidheal
01-05-2015, 12:26 PM
Lucky me - Wayne Easter is my MP.

FML

conger
01-05-2015, 08:43 PM
Lucky me - Wayne Easter is my MP.

FML
Sympathies..... What a bone head.