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View Full Version : Woohoo I just scored an M something. I think?



greywolf67nt
03-05-2016, 07:59 PM
Buddy of mine is moving and had a rifle he was throwing out because it had no bolt. Came with what looks like a ligit sling.
Long story short it is now mine and all I know is that it looks like a short Mosin.
What is the easiest way to tell a 38 from a 44? What should I take pics of to post so you gurus can tell me?
I'm thinking if I can find a Mosin bolt it should work or am I wrong?

IJ22
03-05-2016, 08:21 PM
A 44 will have a bayonet, or at least a lug or the remnants of one.

Edit: Yeah a Mosin bolt has a good chance of working but have a gunsmith check the headspace before firing, not every bolt will be suitable for that individual rifle.

RobertMcC
03-05-2016, 08:30 PM
M44 would have a shorter rear sight that has a band on it that goes around the barrel ( like a No1 MKIII ) and a bayonet that folds sideways.

A M38 would look like a 91/30 but with a shorter barrel, forearm and handguard. The rear sight is the same as a 91/30 but will have 1000+M milled out.

You can get bolts for 30 - 50$. Marstar sells them complete for 30$ when in stock, same with Tradex. Just plop a head space guage in before you pull the trigger.

Only bolt that dont work with M38/9130/M44 is Finish ones M39's or the fin models.

greywolf67nt
03-05-2016, 11:04 PM
Arsenal stamp is just the empty star with 1942 under it.
Then 1891/59
http://i1378.photobucket.com/albums/ah105/randyrose1/M38%204_zps71j7m6lb.jpg
Rear sight is ground off above 1000m like you said Robert
http://i1378.photobucket.com/albums/ah105/randyrose1/M38%203_zpsg5mb9vxb.jpg
Barrel band close to rear sight so it looks like a first pattern stock BUT sling stock escutcheons are not held in with screws in fact there really isn't a front one just a small piece of brass along the bottom.
http://i1378.photobucket.com/albums/ah105/randyrose1/M38%202_zps5y2haffy.jpg
No bayo lug on the front just the band that holds on the front sight.
http://i1378.photobucket.com/albums/ah105/randyrose1/M38%201_zps4qzfdqx9.jpg
Have I found something or just find a bolt and take it out and blast away?

greywolf67nt
03-05-2016, 11:16 PM
Okay I keep digging correct me if I'm wrong but I have a 1942 M91/59?
The stock in the pick I found is identical to mine and it is a Czech stock.
So last mystery is the arsenal mark. Which one used the empty star.

Mark-II
03-05-2016, 11:40 PM
nice score

I passed up one a few years back when I had no idea what it was. The bore wasn't great anyway.

The rear sight being a rifle sight with the numbers past 1000m milled off rather than the shorter carbine sight blade is the dead giveaway that it's a cut down 91/30 (m91/59) rather than an m38

bp2626
03-06-2016, 01:12 AM
It's a 91/59. A post-war (1959) conversion of a 91/30 into a M38 pattern. Any Mosin bolt should drop in and be fine as 7.62x54r headspaces on the rim and is very forgiving. You could pick up a field gauge if you're worried.

If I recall, the latest information is that these were a Bulgarian conversion.

blacksmithden
03-06-2016, 08:17 AM
Congrats R. So.....your friend.....he wouldn't be driving past my place on his way to where ever would he ? Might find he's burning too much fuel.....wants to lighten the load.... ???? :)

greywolf67nt
03-06-2016, 10:47 AM
Moving to Kamloops with a stop over at the office in Edmonton. Unless you want an empty Stack On he is flying with his guns.
I was just doing the final walk through after we loaded his stuff and there it was standing in the closet. I took it down stairs and asked the packers "how did you miss this?".
Buddy was like "It's missing the bolt and I don't know where to get one it's yours if you want it". I was honest and told him where but he said he can't be bothered "it's yours".
I know it's nothing special but IT WAS FREE and for probably $50 I have a "new" rifle.
Best part is I blew the gun budget on my last pistol so my wife can't even roll her eyes at me. Well it didn't stop her but she can't complain at the price.;D

greywolf67nt
03-06-2016, 11:11 AM
Now I need somewhere to buy a bolt. Marstar and Tradex are sold out. Marketplace here I come.
I have the one in my 91/30 I can use to try it but it all matches.

Justice
03-06-2016, 11:16 AM
"...Any Mosin bolt should drop in..." Um, no. Bolts regardless of how the headspace is done are not drop in parts. They require fitting by a smithy. You might get lucky though. Checking headspace isn't difficult, but you need proper headspace gauges. No bits of tape, spent or live cartridges or anything else will do.
$50US will buy a complete set(Go, No-Go and Field) directly from Okie Gauges. Or $35US for a No-Go/Field set. Downside is the exchange rate. No BS at the border for tools.
http://www.okiegauges.com/sales.html
Try Western Gun Parts for a bolt. Marstar is sold out.

Rory McCanuck
03-06-2016, 12:19 PM
Yes, because sizing a case and partially installing a primer, chambering the case and measuring the primer protrusion couldn't possibly give you any indication as to headspace. No, you must spend $50US on gauges for a $50Cdn rifle. :rolleyes:

RobertMcC
03-06-2016, 12:21 PM
"...Any Mosin bolt should drop in..." Um, no. Bolts regardless of how the headspace is done are not drop in parts. They require fitting by a smithy. You might get lucky though. Checking headspace isn't difficult, but you need proper headspace gauges. No bits of tape, spent or live cartridges or anything else will do.
$50US will buy a complete set(Go, No-Go and Field) directly from Okie Gauges. Or $35US for a No-Go/Field set. Downside is the exchange rate. No BS at the border for tools.
http://www.okiegauges.com/sales.html
Try Western Gun Parts for a bolt. Marstar is sold out.

Also WGP wont sell you anything that needs to be gunsmith installed without being a gunsmith. So they wont even sell you a cooey bolt.

Mark-II
03-06-2016, 01:35 PM
Yes, because sizing a case and partially installing a primer, chambering the case and measuring the primer protrusion couldn't possibly give you any indication as to headspace. No, you must spend $50US on gauges for a $50Cdn rifle. :rolleyes:

.....! Thanks for the tip. Does it work for rimless cases though?


Op. Try libertytreecollectors in the states. They have lots of mosin parts. Yes the exchange sucks, but.....supply and command, as Richard says

greywolf67nt
03-06-2016, 06:01 PM
Op. Try libertytreecollectors in the states. They have lots of mosin parts. Yes the exchange sucks, but.....supply and command, as Richard says

Price with exchange not that bad BUT there is that nasty ITARS thing. Emailed and asked if they could ship.

RobertMcC
03-06-2016, 06:11 PM
"...Any Mosin bolt should drop in..." Um, no. Bolts regardless of how the headspace is done are not drop in parts. They require fitting by a smithy. You might get lucky though. Checking headspace isn't difficult, but you need proper headspace gauges. No bits of tape, spent or live cartridges or anything else will do.
$50US will buy a complete set(Go, No-Go and Field) directly from Okie Gauges. Or $35US for a No-Go/Field set. Downside is the exchange rate. No BS at the border for tools.
http://www.okiegauges.com/sales.html
Try Western Gun Parts for a bolt. Marstar is sold out.

Also I'm pretty sure there someone that would lend you a no/go gauge if its a 1 time thing for a small fee and shipping cost.

Rory McCanuck
03-06-2016, 07:52 PM
.....! Thanks for the tip. Does it work for rimless cases though?...
Never really thought about it. With a rimmed case, belted too, I guess, you size the shoulders back so they aren't touching, as that would be where the case was actually headspacing.

If you had a shoulder-headspacing round, it should work.
Take a case, and measure it from the datum to casehead. It should be a couple thou short, right?
Install your spent primer partway, close bolt, measure protrusion and add that to the initial measurement.
Or just measure from the datum to the primer face.
Ta-Dah, your headspace has been measured.
I'd think you might want to do it a few times and take an average, but it should work.

Mark-II
03-07-2016, 07:28 AM
hmm....I'll give it a go someday.


Oh, and ITAR. Liberty Tree wouldn't ship me clips for my Swedish Mauser, because they fall under it. True Story.

I've bought mostly slings, screws, and other small parts from them.

greywolf67nt
03-07-2016, 11:08 AM
hmm....I'll give it a go someday.


Oh, and ITAR. Liberty Tree wouldn't ship me clips for my Swedish Mauser, because they fall under it. True Story.

I've bought mostly slings, screws, and other small parts from them.

Just heard back from them and no they don't ship bolts. Poop

Mark-II
03-07-2016, 01:02 PM
Boo

greywolf67nt
03-07-2016, 08:59 PM
Found one online from a private seller.
Darn near 5 provinces away but I'm in no rush not like I can get to the range right now.