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M1917 Enfield
08-25-2017, 06:01 AM
Hope everybody here is happy to have at least nearly half of their income taken from them in taxes to feed the wasteful government and it's bureaucracy!

And now that the Lieberals are back in power expect the amount you pay in taxes to keep climbing.

I guess this is why so many are resorting to racking up huge levels of debt just to keep their previous standard of living!

http://globalnews.ca/news/3691159/canada-taxes-incomes-fraser-institute/?utm_source=GlobalCalgary&utm_medium=Facebook

Average Canadians pay 42.5 per cent of their income in taxes: report


Canadians pay a whopping 42.5 per cent of their income in taxes, according to a new report by the Fraser Institute.

An average family with an income of about $83,000 paid roughly $35,000 in taxes last year, the Vancouver, B.C.-based think-tank calculated. That overall tax bill accounts for federal, provincial and local taxes, including income, payroll, sales and property taxes.

By comparison, a typical Canadian household used only 37 per cent of its income on basic necessities, according to the report. Spending on housing (including rent and mortgage payments), food and clothing amounted to $31,000 for the typical family.

“Many Canadians may think housing is their biggest household expense, but in fact, the average Canadian family spent more on taxes last year than on life’s basic necessities — including housing,” said Charles Lammam, director of fiscal studies at the Fraser Institute.

Canadians’ tax bill has risen by over 2,000 per cent since 1961, much faster than the price of many consumer products.

The Consumer Price Index (which measures the average price that consumers pay for food, shelter, clothing, transportation, health and personal care, education, and other items) rose by only 718 per cent over the period, the report said.

This represents “a marked shift” since the early 1960s, when the average Canadian family spent around a third of its income on taxes and nearly two-thirds of it on food, clothing and housing.

Still, Canadians are paying a relatively lower tax bill today than they were between the late 1990s and the financial crisis, the data suggests.

In 2000, for example, a whopping 46 per cent of Canadian income was flowing to taxes, the highest share since 1961.

The ratio of taxes to incomes was still hovering around 45 per cent in 2006, but dropped to roughly the current level in 2012.

And the share of income Canadians used to devote to basic necessities literally collapsed during the 1960s and was in steady decline until the early 1980s.

tdod101
08-25-2017, 06:22 AM
And what will Canadians do about it? Nothing.

Doug_M
08-25-2017, 06:56 AM
And what will Canadians do about it? Nothing.

Someone in the comments said something like "yeah, but look at all the free things we get from government like free healthcare, roads, education etc". Of course there were dozens of replies to that trying to point out that none of that was actually free and that we weren't even getting the best bang for the buck. But still it seemed to fall on deaf ears.

Canada_Phil
08-25-2017, 07:16 AM
And now we are apparently adding $ 3 BILLION!!! and climbing into the mix to provide aid and tax-free comfort to all those that our annointed Prince invited here on Twiiter...Irregular... irregulaire?.. Irregulair-ri-lari-lari-ly?

Phew.. making up double-speak words is hard!.. Prince Selfie should just stick with what he knows best... Staging fake photo-op PR stunts.

sltoronto
08-25-2017, 07:35 AM
I guess this average 42% is actually quite misleading ...
most of the population, who is in the lower brackets for income tax but pays HST/GST plus some hidden taxes (e.g., excise, tariffs, etc) pays much less ..

I would suggest to try to roughly estimate your own tax load ..
1) income tax paid from your income
2) HST/GST from your non-food purchases
3) 70% of your gas purchases
4) property taxes
5) health levies
probably somebody can add to this list of obvious taxes ...

my number - ~35% on these five ...

FYI to compare - in USSR it was estimated that the state appropriates ~60% of person's "brutto income" (plus income tax, the rate was 13% + 7% after 100RU/month)

Waterloomike
08-25-2017, 08:24 AM
Someone in the comments said something like "yeah, but look at all the free things we get from government like free healthcare, roads, education etc". Of course there were dozens of replies to that trying to point out that none of that was actually free and that we weren't even getting the best bang for the buck. But still it seemed to fall on deaf ears.

Those ears are painted on.

M1917 Enfield
08-25-2017, 08:46 AM
I guess this average 42% is actually quite misleading ...
most of the population, who is in the lower brackets for income tax but pays HST/GST plus some hidden taxes (e.g., excise, tariffs, etc) pays much less ..

I would suggest to try to roughly estimate your own tax load ..
1) income tax paid from your income
2) HST/GST from your non-food purchases
3) 70% of your gas purchases
4) property taxes
5) health levies
probably somebody can add to this list of obvious taxes ...

my number - ~35% on these five ...

FYI to compare - in USSR it was estimated that the state appropriates ~60% of person's "brutto income" (plus income tax, the rate was 13% + 7% after 100RU/month)

For an example here is all the taxes Ontario directly collected from all sources in 2016 to 2017 -

3398


It does not show how much unseen taxes (still a burden on consumers and quite a bit actually) are passed directly and indirectly onto citizens in deferred taxes through being built into the inflated price or cost of goods and services, third party deliverables and or consumer industry.

Waterloomike
08-25-2017, 08:58 AM
For an example here is all the taxes Ontario directly collected from all sources in 2016 to 2017 -

3398


It does not show how much unseen taxes (still a burden on consumers and quite a bit actually) are passed directly and indirectly onto citizens in deferred taxes through being built into the inflated price or cost of goods and services, third party deliverables and or consumer industry.
Yeah. Iirc there was a Fraser Institute study showing total taxes to be over 50%. I can't look it up right now.

Regardless, the parasitic state is hell bent to suck us dry.

TJSpeller
08-25-2017, 09:58 AM
The only way out of taxes is barter and cash.
Government is going to take the second one away from us as soon as it's politically possible.
They are already trying to do it elsewhere in the world (EU, Australia, India...)

Doug_M
08-25-2017, 10:35 AM
The only way out of taxes is barter and cash.
Government is going to take the second one away from us as soon as it's politically possible.
They are already trying to do it elsewhere in the world (EU, Australia, India...)

Bitcoin. I bought 1 bitcoin for approximately $20 two or three years ago as I wanted some service (probably a VPN, I don't recall) that only accepted payment in them. Anyway, I spent most but not all of that bitcoin and then forgot about it. I checked it out recently, I have 0.065 of a bitcoin and it is worth about $260USD. Bitcoin goes up, then down, then up again like a rollercoaster. But overally it goes up and up and up. Whether its bitcoin itself or some offshoot, crypto currencies will be the cash of the future precisely because gov will try to outlaw cash in order to enforce sales tax.

TJSpeller
08-25-2017, 10:56 AM
I sure hope that cryptocurrencies catch on. It seems to me that governments will outlaw them as soon as they see them as a threat to monetary control.

sltoronto
08-25-2017, 11:07 AM
actually there's no need to outlaw ... everything electronic can be controlled ... chase and catch, of course .. but in general - everything ...

BTW, this is why all the talk about fighting corruption is pure BS ... with USD based world financial system and whole economy,
US Ministry of Finance is aware of every single bank transaction .. it's just most of the corruption actually benefits the USA,
either directly, e.g., by bringing money into US directly or by allowing US control over corrupted elites..

blacksmithden
08-25-2017, 11:44 AM
I WISH it was that low. About 4% of my AFTER tax pay goes to property taxes. 5% to gst, income tax is almost 40% by itself....capital gains on my stock dividends.....it goes on and on. I know Im closer to 60% than 50% when its all factored in.

Sinbad
08-25-2017, 11:46 AM
Don't forget all the environment fees.

sltoronto
08-25-2017, 02:09 PM
income tax is almost 40% by itself.....

I think you are talking about your marginal rate and not a total tax payable ..

If not, congratulations! This wold mean you quite well off by Canadian measures .

I will not put an estimated number out, privacy rules ...

Waterloomike
08-25-2017, 03:19 PM
Yeah. Iirc there was a Fraser Institute study showing total taxes to be over 50%. I can't look it up right now.

Regardless, the parasitic state is hell bent to suck us dry.

43.4%.

https://www.fraserinstitute.org/studies/canadians-celebrate-tax-freedom-day-on-june-9-2017

Still vastly over priced for corruption, incompetence and flat out ripoffs.

Of course, the greater your income, the greater your tax rate.

Donny Fenn
08-25-2017, 03:29 PM
I think you are talking about your marginal rate and not a total tax payable ..

If not, congratulations! This wold mean you quite well off by Canadian measures .

I will not put an estimated number out, privacy rules ...

sltoronto, dude, it's like you enjoy paying taxes. Marginal/total it matters not "we" pay too much for ANY of the "services" provided. There is NO reason for anyone in the country to be paying more than 25% of their income for all taxes combined. The fact that the morons in Ottawa now want to punish small businesses, professionals and independent tradespeople may finally be what pushes us all over the edge to a tax revolt so the gov't (all of them) wake up. Taxation is theft.

TJSpeller
08-25-2017, 03:42 PM
I think you are talking about your marginal rate and not a total tax payable ..

If not, congratulations! This wold mean you quite well off by Canadian measures .

I will not put an estimated number out, privacy rules ...


Yes, but here's the thing. The numbers are not exactly right, and would vary between provinces. The concept is that on the first, say, 100K you or your company earn, you get taxed 30%. On the next 50K you get taxed 40%. On the next 50, 50%, and above that 60%.

What's your incentive to work hard to earn those 40 or 50 cent dollars? Life is short. Don't grow your business. Spend more time at home with family. Why hire those extra staff... too much stress (nothing is more stressful than HR)?

Dewey Cox
08-25-2017, 04:36 PM
If we were conquered and enslaved by another country, I don't think we'd get taxed this much.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

sltoronto
08-25-2017, 04:58 PM
sltoronto, dude, it's like you enjoy paying taxes. Marginal/total it matters not "we" pay too much for ANY of the "services" provided. There is NO reason for anyone in the country to be paying more than 25% of their income for all taxes combined. The fact that the morons in Ottawa now want to punish small businesses, professionals and independent tradespeople may finally be what pushes us all over the edge to a tax revolt so the gov't (all of them) wake up. Taxation is theft.

sorry if you got that impression ... way too much .... and, to add salt and pepper on a bleeding wound - it's being wasted as there are no tomorrow ... pittance in return to the paying folks ...

sltoronto
08-25-2017, 05:07 PM
Yes, but here's the thing. The numbers are not exactly right, and would vary between provinces. The concept is that on the first, say, 100K you or your company earn, you get taxed 30%. On the next 50K you get taxed 40%. On the next 50, 50%, and above that 60%.

What's your incentive to work hard to earn those 40 or 50 cent dollars? Life is short. Don't grow your business. Spend more time at home with family. Why hire those extra staff... too much stress (nothing is more stressful than HR)?


went through that too ... a group of people with idea ... then a group added to move it forward ... and then comes and grows in geometric proportion a cancer ..
red tape, licenses, compliance, HR, moronic rules, etc ... at certain point you realize you are working for a black hole ...

and agree on HR ... dirty stuff too... for many years was and still do refuse to accept any position which includes that ... keeping straight technical ...

All the best with your business, TJSpeller!

shortandlong
08-25-2017, 05:36 PM
I guess this average 42% is actually quite misleading ...
most of the population, who is in the lower brackets for income tax but pays HST/GST plus some hidden taxes (e.g., excise, tariffs, etc) pays much less ..

I would suggest to try to roughly estimate your own tax load ..
1) income tax paid from your income
2) HST/GST from your non-food purchases
3) 70% of your gas purchases
4) property taxes
5) health levies
probably somebody can add to this list of obvious taxes ...

my number - ~35% on these five ...

FYI to compare - in USSR it was estimated that the state appropriates ~60% of person's "brutto income" (plus income tax, the rate was 13% + 7% after 100RU/month)

coming from someone from toronto .....it must be true

tdod101
08-25-2017, 05:53 PM
Bitcoin. I bought 1 bitcoin for approximately $20 two or three years ago as I wanted some service (probably a VPN, I don't recall) that only accepted payment in them. Anyway, I spent most but not all of that bitcoin and then forgot about it. I checked it out recently, I have 0.065 of a bitcoin and it is worth about $260USD. Bitcoin goes up, then down, then up again like a rollercoaster. But overally it goes up and up and up. Whether its bitcoin itself or some offshoot, crypto currencies will be the cash of the future precisely because gov will try to outlaw cash in order to enforce sales tax.

I looked into bitcoin recently and found out as a Canadian it is impossible to use it as a speculation simply because Canada.

I could buy all the crypto currency I want and even buy physical things with it, but if I wanted to sell it and make profit from speculation I was SOL. There are no digital banks that allow Canadians to sell crypto currency and if they claim to be chances are it's a scam.

Reading further in to it, the safest way to store your currency is on an encrypted USB drive is insanity. I like the concept but being Canadian makes it useless..

RangeBob
08-25-2017, 06:06 PM
red tape, licenses, compliance, HR, moronic rules, etc ... at certain point you realize you are working for a black hole ...

The USA implemented a two-for-one law, requiring that whenever a new regulation was placed upon a business, that two existing regulations had to be removed.

Then Canada implemented a one-for-one law, requiring that whenever a new regulation was placed upon a business, that an existing regulation had to be removed. The Conservatives followed this a lot. I think they also wrote the law.
I saw one Liberal gazette entry that said something like "Because we didn't implement a regulation for this, we don't need to remove a regulation."

I've commented on this before here at GoC, so it should be searchable.

sltoronto
08-25-2017, 06:25 PM
coming from someone from toronto .....it must be true

toronto?? true? must be? comprehension problems?

Waterloomike
08-25-2017, 08:42 PM
Well I do agree that when it hits you that you are a tax slave to the whimsical, ridiculous people making laws, it's very hard to want to do what it takes to continue in the role.

Whatever you do, it's not as much for you as it is for them. Whatever you can earn and keep, they keep far more than you get for what they take. However you do it, they decide.

I'm not a willing slave. And that is the gateway to or from the blackhole.