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SIR VEYOR
11-10-2017, 02:51 PM
This looks really interesting. Sort of a Bluetooth Private network, can interface over wifi and cell as well. And while seeking pricey, it would be worth it depending on. Your intended uses.

Look useful for hunting groups, emergency situations, and when areas of cel towers are turned off to prevent communication from unwanted people, or during events.

https://www.gotenna.com

It looks like they might be trying to do a big push in PR as well. If it works there, they've really have proven their model, capability, and product should explode.

Due to the alternative nature of the product, I picked here instead of gear junky.

Jay.ec
11-10-2017, 06:44 PM
I have to admit it looks pretty cool. Though my question is what is the range on a single pair of GoTennas? (The website doesn't really say.) I mean true they work better as a mesh... but that's an ideal situation. Life isn't always ideal and can't really rely on people around having them. (Especially not at first.)

Booletsnotreactwell
11-10-2017, 07:54 PM
I don't really understand what void this is supposed to fill, you can use encryption with on-grid networks, on grid-networks are more efficient and if I really need off grid networks I wouldn't even bother with a common cell phone and just go with a satellite phone (more efficient and still can use encryption) or just get UHF/VHF radios.



Sounds like basically a way for millennials to experience two way radios without actually having to go through the trouble of experiencing two way radios.

Jay.ec
11-11-2017, 08:59 PM
For me, what it seems to try to do is allow users to keep using existing hardware (their cellphones) even when the main cellular network is down or flooded due to emergency situations. (Or like they show in demos, when travelling and people are spread out.) Satellite phones could work but not everyone has one and they can be costly. Plus if the main phone lines are down/flooded anyway even with a satellite phone you might not get through.

Another important difference between this and a 2 way radio is that your message is going to the other person/group. On a 2 way radio anyone can jump in and respond. Which at times can be useful, but then at other times if you only want to talk to your friend having some other person on the line constantly interjecting can be a real nuisance.

Swampdonkey
11-11-2017, 10:34 PM
Range is critical, but I see the use for areas without cell service. Hunt, work, keep in touch with family . . .

Booletsnotreactwell
11-12-2017, 12:38 AM
Nowadays you can buy UHF/VHF radios for cheap, I think technically you need to be licensed on those spectrums so it keeps people off the airwaves unlike CB but it's not really enforced.

Doug_M
11-12-2017, 07:11 AM
There's no technically about it. Frequency spectrum is managed by Industry Canada (changed their name to something else when Libs got in) and the only VHF/UHF you can use unlicensed is FRS and GMRS. And even then only with equipment certified for use on those frequencies. Any cheap Chinese radio you buy off eBay or wherever is 100% illegal for you to transmit on. The only exception being in situations of life and death or severe injury as well as major property damage.

The amateur radio (ham radio) license to use them is pretty easy but not easy enough as it covers other sections that only pertain to those interested in HF (world-wide radio comms). I have and will continue to advocate that licensing/examination for UHF/VHF only amateur radio be made easier to make it more accessible. That's a win win for everyone. Unfortunately these things move slowly.

Doug_M
11-12-2017, 07:15 AM
Oh, and the lack of enforcement is simply due to there not being staff to monitor these frequencies. Hams will report unauthorized use if they hear it and they will have triangulated you first. But Canada is big, if you live in rural Canada and are intelligent about what frequencies you use you likely won't get caught. Still, a license is worthwhile just for the knowledge.

Booletsnotreactwell
11-12-2017, 02:56 PM
Oh, and the lack of enforcement is simply due to there not being staff to monitor these frequencies. Hams will report unauthorized use if they hear it and they will have triangulated you first. But Canada is big, if you live in rural Canada and are intelligent about what frequencies you use you likely won't get caught. Still, a license is worthwhile just for the knowledge.

Most casual users aren't going to bother with licenses. I mean it might not be correct, but if done in the right way you aren't going to be disturbing anyone or causing any issues. I know plenty of people who regularly use the cheap Chinese UHF radios. Guys out on hunting trips, off roading, doing a big road trip traveling in a convoy. They would use CB but CB sucks ass, it's full of idiots talking about BS non stop, making donkey noises, etc.




About this triangulation stuff, is that only the equivalent of range nazis in ham that do that or everyone? Do they need special gear to do that or is it something anybody can do?



Lastly, (Enemy of the State reference), if these guys are good how long before they get you? Say you were a dumb ass playing music over unauthorized frequencies in a city like Toronto. How long would you think before they have you made?

SIR VEYOR
11-12-2017, 03:31 PM
I have to admit it looks pretty cool. Though my question is what is the range on a single pair of GoTennas? (The website doesn't really say.) I mean true they work better as a mesh... but that's an ideal situation. Life isn't always ideal and can't really rely on people around having them. (Especially not at first.)

It looks like the first version was 900Mhz area, but had issues from so many people. Next versions, which seem to be the actual production ones, are different frequencies. I think they are claiming up to about 9km, ideal conditions. So definitely "Cobra handheld" competition at least.

I do like the fact it eliminates another charger, and the cords are more likely to be found outside cities and regular business hours. Gas stations sell most types of charge cords nowadays.

Another advantage over the handhelds is that the user is operating something they are familiar with, and you don't need to interrupt what they're doing to get the message to them. Have phone on silent and you can text that the trophy buck is going by behind them, not where they're looking. Trying that on a handheld, likely game will bolt...

Doug_M
11-12-2017, 03:32 PM
Only reason is because lack of enforcement. In the US they have enforcement and regularly fine people $10,000.

Not interfering is important, but one doesn’t know for sure they’re not interfering. Those cheap Chinese radios produce spurious signals on frequencies other than what is on the dial. Also just because you don’t hear anyone on a frequency doesn’t mean they aren’t picking up your signal either.

If someone unlicensed sticks to the FRS/GMRS frequencies and low power I wouldn’t report them. But if they were operating in the ham bands I wouldn’t hesitate to report them. They’ve got no right being there and no knowledge about RF and what interference they may be causing.

Take the course, earn the license or “get off my lawn!” lol


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

Doug_M
11-12-2017, 03:36 PM
Don’t need special equipment for triangulation.

Most hams would report you. It’s not like range nazis. More like you are stealing from us. It’s our bandwidth not yours and we are very protective of it. We have to protect it from all kinds of “intruders”.

Enforcement is reactive and usually starts with a report. Music on the radio if consistent will eventually get reported. Lots of hams in Toronto.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

SIR VEYOR
11-12-2017, 03:43 PM
I don't really understand what void this is supposed to fill, you can use encryption with on-grid networks, on grid-networks are more efficient and if I really need off grid networks I wouldn't even bother with a common cell phone and just go with a satellite phone (more efficient and still can use encryption) or just get UHF/VHF radios.


Well, part of the void is that on-grid networks are controlled by others and susceptible to disruptions planned or otherwise. Your data and other information is being tracked, stored, disseminated, etc by others, encryption or not. Networks were disabled during Ferguson and "cloned towers" might have been used at North Dakota, as examples.

This would allow you to communicate outside those bubbles, or even inside them to others. Now, this is essentially an App with a hardware feature in some respects, but being able to extend your comm lines, even to an internet connection is also very HAM like. But, the user doesn't need to know jack, and is already familiar with the interface. It removes many barriers to that level of communication.

Sat phones are still one to one comms, expensive, and do have intermittent windows of coverage/service. And it looks like more than one phone can use each antenna at the same time. So flexible, easier, cheaper, than other options. It offers a seamless integration factor that is the disruptive feature.

They are rolling this out in Puerto Rico in a big way. If it works there, they have a good chance of becoming the dominant player essentially overnight.

Booletsnotreactwell
11-12-2017, 04:52 PM
Well, part of the void is that on-grid networks are controlled by others and susceptible to disruptions planned or otherwise. Your data and other information is being tracked, stored, disseminated, etc by others, encryption or not. Networks were disabled during Ferguson and "cloned towers" might have been used at North Dakota, as examples.

This would allow you to communicate outside those bubbles, or even inside them to others. Now, this is essentially an App with a hardware feature in some respects, but being able to extend your comm lines, even to an internet connection is also very HAM like. But, the user doesn't need to know jack, and is already familiar with the interface. It removes many barriers to that level of communication.

Sat phones are still one to one comms, expensive, and do have intermittent windows of coverage/service. And it looks like more than one phone can use each antenna at the same time. So flexible, easier, cheaper, than other options. It offers a seamless integration factor that is the disruptive feature.

They are rolling this out in Puerto Rico in a big way. If it works there, they have a good chance of becoming the dominant player essentially overnight.

Alright so sounds like the next tool the waves of SJW will be using at protests. How to do I invest in this company so I can make money off them?

SIR VEYOR
11-13-2017, 06:54 AM
Alright so sounds like the next tool the waves of SJW will be using at protests. How to do I invest in this company so I can make money off them?

Well, it doesn't look like they've done an IPO yet. And REI is in the mix somehow now as well. And their last round was in April, so they wouldn't be looking for a bit I expect.

So likely your best option is to contact them directly to ask about next round funding options and expected minimum single investor outlay; or when/if an IPO might be scheduled. Let us know what you find out, some of us might follow your investing strategy discussed in another thread on this one.

And they did post something interesting on Twitter

@goTenna Mesh point-to-point range record: 47.4 mi! Learn more (it involves sailplanes and a special app someone is building using our SDK) here: meshcommunity.gotenn… #i meshyou

So there is some third party stuff on the go as well it seems

Jay.ec
11-13-2017, 12:35 PM
9 KM is actually a lot more than I was expecting. (I was kind of figuring like maybe 2 KM at most for range.) Which means it wouldn't take nearly as many GoTennas to cover a pretty wide area.

Though there are definitely uses for these. The hunting use was something I hadn't considered. Plus I could see these being useful in major disasters or if there's an attack (hopefully not though). And of course the travel example. (I was on vacation not too long ago and it might have been nice to have these then...)

Doug_M
11-13-2017, 01:41 PM
9 KM is actually a lot more than I was expecting. (I was kind of figuring like maybe 2 KM at most for range.) Which means it wouldn't take nearly as many GoTennas to cover a pretty wide area.

Though there are definitely uses for these. The hunting use was something I hadn't considered. Plus I could see these being useful in major disasters or if there's an attack (hopefully not though). And of course the travel example. (I was on vacation not too long ago and it might have been nice to have these then...)

Cell phones and these things are radios. They are ultra high frequency radios at that. The propagation of RF at those frequencies is going to depend on a lot of things. As these devices are quite limited in output power and they have teeny antennas, the most importantly factor in determining range will be height. Second to that will be terrain and obstacles. UHF is line of sight.

All that being said I can guarantee you their long range they got was with one of these things up very high to another one up high with no obstacles in between. Hunting in the woods? You'll get a couple km if that.

Doug_M
11-13-2017, 02:06 PM
I just had a look at their twitter and that 47 mile record was indeed accomplished with extreme height and no obstacles. They took them up in a glider. So interesting, but otherwise a dubious claim for real world applications.

SIR VEYOR
11-14-2017, 06:22 AM
I just had a look at their twitter and that 47 mile record was indeed accomplished with extreme height and no obstacles. They took them up in a glider. So interesting, but otherwise a dubious claim for real world applications.

Yes, I'm not putting much faith in the distances claimed over the Cobra handhelds for reliability. The tweet was mostly that people are toying with the hardware for essentially fun and humble brags. But the bigger kicker is the fact that possibly third parties have access and are developing things off this product.

There's not much info yet, but the PR efforts for a case study and disaster response model they're developing has promise.

SIR VEYOR
11-14-2017, 06:29 AM
Though there are definitely uses for these.

The GPS and map display of position might be useful for off roading, hiking, campsite to late arrivals, etc.

That feature is sort of like APRS in the HAM world, especially when they're using something like OziExplorer

And the Garmin Rhinos. And they haven't exactly ruled the handheld radio market.

Doug_M
11-14-2017, 07:16 AM
There's not much info yet, but the PR efforts for a case study and disaster response model they're developing has promise.

Yes I think this will be their forte. Distribute a bucket load of them in a disaster zone and let the people stuck on the ground build out a mesh cell network.