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lone-wolf
02-22-2013, 01:30 AM
Anyone try one from the recent batch?

So shoot me, I had good luck with norcs in the past.

Satain
02-23-2013, 03:03 AM
Friend has one. They are alright if you know how to make them work better. By that I mean. How to install pillars and bed it. Do a triger job. Re-crown it proper. True the action. and use some heavy duty expoy clear coat to make the stock much more ridged and hardder plus at the same time ensure that it is free floated.
But besides that they should be good to go. Just wish that they got more 7.62x39mm in stock. Even more so now that I know how to load subsonic rounds for it. Plus under 300 meters it works great on medium to small sized game.

lone-wolf
10-31-2013, 03:58 PM
It seems I just bought one.

Strewth
11-01-2013, 10:08 AM
It seems I just bought one.

Mmmm. Sleepwalking again?
Congrats! Affordable bolt x39 is very good idea. Pics, range report, and then sell at steep discount to GOC members whose names end in "ewth"?

lone-wolf
11-01-2013, 10:41 AM
.223 not the 7.62 version

Got it used from gagnon in excellent condition. The savage in excellent condition I got from them looked like it was unfired.
I will try bedding it & float the barrel and see how it shoots.
I wonder if I can install a peep sight on it.

Strewth
11-01-2013, 10:47 AM
Oh sorry! I get the Norinco designations confused, I should Google before I post on them. Still a nice rifle, and my offer of steep discounts is still on the table....:).

lone-wolf
11-01-2013, 11:03 AM
my offer of steep discounts is still on the table....:).
lol of course it is

lone-wolf
11-12-2013, 10:02 AM
Looks like whoever bought it before me didn't even clean the grease off it.
This thing is ROUGH! haha youtube videos do not lie, the stock was inletted by a monkey with the claw end of a hammer!
So, first thing after cleaning, and before I even fired a shot, I attempted a JB bedding job. I never bedded anything in my life.
Got the basic concept from: http://www.theboxotruth.com/docs/edu75.htm
Hopefully I didn't just ruin my near new $250 norc!

The good? I kind of like the stock iron sights, and the trigger isn't the worst.

Strewth
11-12-2013, 11:04 AM
Can't see how you would ruin it by bedding, unless you've locked the action and stock together...I find bedding a lot of fun:). Get to play with play-doh, slather your rifle in shoe polish and make a cool impression of your action; one of the few times a dremel is A-OK to use on a firearm as well.
I'm sure it worked out fine for you.

lone-wolf
11-12-2013, 11:16 AM
http://i767.photobucket.com/albums/xx313/redmudpei/random%20gun-bullet%20stuff/IMG_20131112_124900_zps7acd431c.jpg

Strewth
11-12-2013, 11:26 AM
Very nice! So, the bedding worked, or that's a before picture?

lone-wolf
11-12-2013, 11:46 AM
That's a during picture I suppose, couple more hours I will remove the stock from the action, clean it up a little and let the stock sit for 24hr before putting it all back together(or adding more bedding material, we'll see)

Update:
Note, 3hrs isn't enough time sitting for it to firm up. D'oh.

mlehto
11-12-2013, 12:44 PM
I'm very interested in the outcome of this.

Have been tossing around the idea of getting one of these....

lone-wolf
11-12-2013, 12:56 PM
Something is crooked. I believe the scope bases are in line, but off centered(to the right). The irons sights to be dead center.
Might be why whoever bought it, did not want it.

lone-wolf
11-12-2013, 01:42 PM
Additional note: Turtle wax, in the liquid bottle form, was a horrible release agent in my opinion.
Oh well. I ended up putting additional JB weld into the stock, I will leave it till tomorrow before I touch it now. It's damp & cold out, so I'll just leave it alone for longer.

Then, tomorrow at some point, I will shoot it. Scoping it seems out of the question at the moment.

mlehto
11-12-2013, 02:13 PM
Sounds good.

I am more interested in Irons anyways, and you are the second person to tell me they are decent.

Strewth
11-12-2013, 08:49 PM
That's a during picture I suppose, couple more hours I will remove the stock from the action, clean it up a little and let the stock sit for 24hr before putting it all back together(or adding more bedding material, we'll see)

Update:
Note, 3hrs isn't enough time sitting for it to firm up. D'oh.

How did you squish the metal down into the wood? I use electrical tape?

lone-wolf
11-12-2013, 09:12 PM
How did you squish the metal down into the wood? I use electrical tape?
Generous amount of release agent(turtle wax and froglube - haha) on the screws and reinserted them, snugged them down not tight.
I removed the stock... after hitting it a lot. The screws came out relatively easily, just needed leverage.
Applied around 3:43pm, was around 9:30pm when I started removing it, nice and solid JB weld now.
Not bad, some minor JB weld missing(see: issues) I think it'd be an easy touch up if I feel like it.
Currently the stock and action are separate, and will remain so for 24hrs, then they will be put back together tight.

Issues: some JB weld was stuck to the rifle more than the stock. Bad release agent and wood not cleaned enough?
Also, JB weld stuck to rifle is hard to remove. I say screw it, and leave the little bits on it. I scrapped what I could off with a knife.

Re: Scope base.
Looking at the base screw holes after the bases were removed, the screw holes actually look correct and centered.
Also, I asked a CGNer with the same rifle, he told me he left the factory bases on(although 1 screw hole was stripped from factory) and threw on a scope anyways - and it shoots good with winchester white box JHPs.
So, I may throw on a scope for the hell of it. If someone knows of any good bases that will fit the factory holes, let me know.

Strewth
11-12-2013, 09:58 PM
First time I tried bedding with JB Weld I used...I think PAM cooking spray? Terrible idea, do not recommend. Since then for JB and for MarineTex I use clear Kiwi shoe polish, works like a charm. Black polish is way easier to find, but I'm scared:).
Wood maybe not clean enough, or maybe too thin a layer of bedding? I get silly with the dremel and drill bit now.

lone-wolf
11-12-2013, 10:01 PM
Yea, it was up along the sides, so it was a thin part.

Strewth
11-12-2013, 10:04 PM
Meh, trim it up pretty. Shouldn't matter, especially since it sounds like you've pillar bedded as well?

lone-wolf
11-12-2013, 10:10 PM
No pillers.

mlehto
11-13-2013, 06:25 AM
Alright, where is the range report already???????

LOL

lone-wolf
11-13-2013, 11:50 AM
I put the rifle back together, tried bore sighting(removed bolt, look through barrel & adjust scope) and ran out of left adjustment. No surprise, the scope bases are off to the right and the scope is a cheap bushnell.
Anyways, loaded up 3 rounds just to test fire in the back yard.
After two shots, I noticed a primer blew out so I stopped shooting.
Ammo is the 45gr winchester white box.

Blown primers made me immediately worried about headspace, so where should I got from here?
factory case length: ~1.750
Spent case 1: 1.756
Spent case 2, blown primer: 1.757

mlehto
11-13-2013, 12:15 PM
That doesn't seem to be too far off.

I would mic the case and compare all dimensions to spec.

It is the shoulder you need to look at more than OAL.

lone-wolf
11-13-2013, 01:55 PM
So, how do I measure the shoulder exactly? Do I measure the diameter right behind it on the top of the body?
.359 right behind the shoulder on the case body.
.258 on the neck of the case
.379 on the lower case body, by the case head?
Brass is pretty dang hard to extract after shooting too.

lone-wolf
11-13-2013, 04:32 PM
Following is from handling and fondling for the last day...

Thoughts so far:
-Rifle looks decent from afar, but is far from decent.

Pros:
-Irons are decent.
-The couple times I pulled the trigger it went bang
-I don't mind the trigger pull
-LOP seems right, shoulders nicely

Cons:
-Stock is garbage, inletted by claw hammer.
-Action is not smooth, gets jammed up a lot with just normal cycling: Push bolt handle up, cycle it to the rear, push it forward - jam. Hit it, fiddle around, till it returns fully forward
-Sometimes, it will not cock, you're left with a dead trigger
-Weaver bases are crap
-Scope base holes are not centered
-Trigger group is lose, rattles around alot. When safety is engaged, it rattles around even more(odd)
-Blew out a primer
-Need way above average force to cycle the spent round out of the rifle
-Damages brass(dents the mouth, the extractor rim is chewed a bit)
-Inserting a magazine is currently a two handed job
-Magazine didn't feed to well(still early, might improve), and the follower tilts easily.

Left to be determined:
Accuracy.

Conclusions:
-I probably should of bought a CZ carbine if I wanted a .223 with irons(you can even get peep sights for it!)
-Or a Ruger mini14 which I also wanted at the time.
-The rifle feels good. I like handling it. I like shouldering the rifle and looking down the irons. When I cycle the action, the roughness, the occasional jamming, and the occasional time the rifle doesn't cock, leaves me overall disappointed.

.
.
.

With regards to my bedding job, I didn't snug the forward action screw enough, so it sits a little higher than normal in the stock now.
Doesn't seem detrimental to anything. Barrel is free float till just a head of the action where the jb weld is.
Inserted the stock today, and it's very snugged.
So, it may not be a professional job, but I think it's better than what I started with(if only by a fractional margin). Maybe the next time, it'll be even better. ect. ect. practice makes perfect and all that stuff.

mlehto
11-13-2013, 07:14 PM
So you don't recommend it then......?

LOL

Thanks for the honest review. I was considering it as a project gun with it's price point, but just seems like a lost cause, especially with the chambering issues.

lone-wolf
11-13-2013, 07:25 PM
If You can handle one, or better yet shoot one, before you buy - then try one.
Dry cycling the action, I got to slap it around to be consistent.
Dang, a bit of refinement they'd be quite the rifle.
Watching cz527 carbine reviews though, I want one. The action looks silky smooth and for the price it better be.
Maybe a tax return purchase for the new year?
Until then, I'll just keep shooting this one, should be a range day tomorrow.

Satain
11-14-2013, 10:17 AM
All of thought's things that you listed as con's took me one Saturday to correct and that included a cerakote graphite black paint job.
Bedded and polyurethane the stock for enhanced stiffness and rigidity.
Lapped the bolt.
Re-did the trigger and set it to 2.5 pounds.
Enlarged and beveled the ejection port.
Aligned the magazine and magwell to be a one hand job and also to feed properly.
Scope mount's and wholes were never an issue with me as mine were done properly from the factory.
Sorry to here you were having such rough time with yours. Should have sold you mine.

lone-wolf
11-14-2013, 12:14 PM
Took one shot today, and am happy to still have my eyesight...

http://i767.photobucket.com/albums/xx313/redmudpei/IMG_20131114_140015_zps9bc0dd61.jpg
http://i767.photobucket.com/albums/xx313/redmudpei/IMG_20131114_140035_zps2b624036.jpg

Strewth
11-14-2013, 12:22 PM
WTF!

Glad to hear you're OK, man! Any ideas what happened?? Is that the same box of ammo you were worried about before?

lone-wolf
11-14-2013, 12:23 PM
Yea, same winchester white box stuff. The same I shot in this rifle before(and rifles before it)

You can see where the barrel pin goes through, it cracked right along that and the barrel moved forward from the action.
The magazine blew out the bottom and ripped the mag catch out with it.
The stock would be in 2 pieces if the crossbolt didn't hold it together.
The bolt can be rotated now i took a hammer to it, but not the full 90degrees. So I can't open the action.

I had some freaking adrenaline going after that.

I know now, after the primer blew out, I should of just trashed the rifle. Stupid me shot it again.

mlehto
11-14-2013, 01:07 PM
WOW!!

So I definitely shouldn't buy one then......

Glad youre OK man.

Go buy a couple lottery tickets for sure!!!

Canuck
11-14-2013, 01:09 PM
Jeebus!! Just Jeebus!! Was this a private sale? If not, can you not get your money back? Wow, lesson learned with no harm done. Very lucky.
Glad you are ok.

lone-wolf
11-14-2013, 01:15 PM
Jeebus!! Just Jeebus!! Was this a private sale? If not, can you not get your money back? Wow, lesson learned with no harm done. Very lucky.
Glad you are ok.

I bought it used from Gagnon. I called up today, they made sure I wasn't injured, then told me he'll refund me the money. I offered to email him these pictures, told me not to worry about it, took my word for it.
I am more worried about who sold gagnon the rifle, if they knew it had the potential to blow up in the next guy's face. If so, that guy's an asshole!

Strewth
11-14-2013, 01:43 PM
I just wondered if the rest of the box of ammo could be pulled apart, and the amounts of powder looked at.

And now that we're sure you're safe, and you're even getting a refund on a used rifle:




So shoot me, I had good luck with norcs in the past.

lol.

Croats
11-14-2013, 01:50 PM
WOW!!

So I definitely shouldn't buy one then......

Glad youre OK man.

Go buy a couple lottery tickets for sure!!!

No kidding, X 2 on that glad you are ok and sorry about rifle.

Satain
11-15-2013, 04:47 PM
Took one shot today, and am happy to still have my eyesight...

http://i767.photobucket.com/albums/xx313/redmudpei/IMG_20131114_140015_zps9bc0dd61.jpg
http://i767.photobucket.com/albums/xx313/redmudpei/IMG_20131114_140035_zps2b624036.jpg
WTF!!!!!
DUDE I WOULD BE POSTAL!
What the hell?
Was it the ammo or was it the cheap metal?

lone-wolf
11-15-2013, 04:59 PM
WTF!!!!!
DUDE I WOULD BE POSTAL!
What the hell?
Was it the ammo or was it the cheap metal?

I was cursing up a storm, but I guess my voice doesn't carry far enough west for ya to hear! :p
I think it was the rifle, the OP's post here describes what it was doing to me, along with the deformed brass(didn't notice it before):
http://www.outdoorsmenforum.ca/showthread.php?t=86217

I'm sending the spent brass to someone on CGN who offered to take a look at it.


I found the magazine today, it blew right through the bottom of the magazine ripping the 'lips' off of the bottom cover of the magazine that the cover slides on to.
I'm happy everything bad was mostly directed not at my face.

mlehto
11-15-2013, 06:21 PM
WTF!!!!!
DUDE I WOULD BE POSTAL!
What the hell?
Was it the ammo or was it the cheap metal?

How many Saturdays would this take to fix up?

LMFAO

Satain
11-16-2013, 03:13 AM
How many Saturdays would this take to fix up?

LMFAO
New barrel 1 day. modified from a CZ
New Stock 2 day's made from scratch.
Never being able to shoot a nork again could be priceless.
But can't really joke in this matter cause this is totally unacceptable.
Who on CGN you sent the brass to? Got a pic for me. I am ready to scream to the high heavens at John from North Sylvia about this 1 for you, if they don't take care of you asap.

superbrad
11-16-2013, 09:13 AM
That is some scary stuff Lonewolf.... I am glad you are OK.... This is why I don't skimp on firearm purchases... I may not have as many guns as some but when I do buy one I make sure it's of decent quality.... Gagnon are good folks and it's great that they are taking good care of you.....

lone-wolf
11-16-2013, 09:28 AM
Who on CGN you sent the brass to?

Ganderite

Brass looks normal, but where the shoulder meets the neck, when you roll them you can see that part isn't squared off and round like it should be.

I don't have the rifle anymore, someone wanted it so I gave it away.

mlehto
11-16-2013, 10:25 AM
There is a review somewhere online I read about the chamber being out of kine from the barrel.

Cant remember where but his was really bad.

How anyone can actually be selling these guns is crazy to me.

Seems like a serious liability issue.

lone-wolf
11-16-2013, 04:56 PM
OH FFS, there was a coyote in the field across from the house today!

Satain
11-17-2013, 01:48 AM
There is a review somewhere online I read about the chamber being out of kine from the barrel.

Cant remember where but his was really bad.

How anyone can actually be selling these guns is crazy to me.

Seems like a serious liability issue.
Not all rifles are bad. Mine I never had any issue's that were not cosmetic but this is a total failure to the high heavens. Going to bug Ganderite then.

mlehto
11-17-2013, 08:31 AM
No doubt there are a few good ones but buying one of these is a gamble.

I'll stick to Savage for cheap rifles for now....