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View Full Version : Residents angry as RCMP sieze guns from High River homes



RobSmith
06-27-2013, 04:26 PM
http://www.calgaryherald.com/news/alberta/Hell+Residents+angry+RCMP+sieze+guns+from+High+Riv er+homes/8588851/story.html


HIGH RIVER — RCMP revealed Thursday that officers have seized a “substantial amount” of firearms from homes in the evacuated town of High River.
“We just want to make sure that all of those things are in a spot that we control, simply because of what they are,” said Sgt. Brian Topham.

“People have a significant amount of money invested in firearms ... so we put them in a place that we control and that they’re safe.”

That news didn’t sit well with a crowd of frustrated residents who had planned to breach a police checkpoint northwest of the town as an evacuation order stretched into its eighth day.

“I find that absolutely incredible that they have the right to go into a person’s belongings out of their home,” said resident Brenda Lackey, after learning Mounties have been taking residents’ guns. “When people find out about this there’s going to be untold hell to pay.”

See photos from the scene.

About 30 RCMP officers set up a blockade at the checkpoint, preventing 50 residents from walking into the town. Dozens more police cars, lights on, could be seen lining streets in the town on standby.

Officers laid down a spike belt to stop anyone from attempting to drive past the blockade. That action sent the crowd of residents into a rage.

“What’s next? Tear gas?” shouted one resident.

“It’s just like Nazi Germany, just taking orders,” shouted another.

“This is the reason the U.S. has the right to bear arms,” said Charles Timpano, pointing to the group of Mounties.

Officers were ordered to fall back about an hour into the standoff in order to diffuse the situation and listen to residents’ concerns.

“We don’t want our town to turn into another New Orleans,” said resident Jeff Langford. “The longer that the water stays in our houses the worse it’s going to be. We’ll either be bulldozing them or burning them down because we’ve got an incompetent government.”

Langford blasted High River Mayor Emile Blokland over comments made Wednesday in which Blokland said residents will be allowed to return after businesses, such as hardware and drug stores, are opened.

“It was ridiculous,” said Langford. “I think he’s a puppet on a string.”

Langford said Premier Redford should come to High River to address residents’ concerns and provide information.

“This is at the highest tension,” he said. “What’s going to happen next is that people are just going to be walking across these fields, and I don’t care if they put hundreds of thousand of police officers there, they’re not going to stop from getting in.”

Sgt. Topham said he didn’t know when residents would be allowed to return to their homes. “People much higher up are going to make those decisions,” he said.

He did confirm that officer relied on forced entry to get into numerous houses during the early stages of the flood because of an “urgent need”, said Topham.

Police are no longer forcing themselves into homes and the residences that were forced open will be secured, he said.

Topham said the confiscated firearms have been inventoried and are secured at an RCMP detachment. He was not at liberty to say how many firearms had been confiscated.


“We have seized a large quantity of firearms simply because they were left by residents in their places,” said Topham.

The guns will be returned to owners after residents are allowed back in town and they provide proof of ownership, Topham added.

Residents promised to returned to the checkpoint at noon every day until they are allowed to return to their homes.


Read more: http://www.calgaryherald.com/Hell+Residents+angry+RCMP+sieze+guns+from+High+Riv er+homes/8588851/story.html#ixzz2XST0mik3

RobSmith
06-27-2013, 04:27 PM
Seriously ... WTF ????

coastal
06-27-2013, 04:34 PM
WOW are you f'ing kidding me?? One flood and they seize all the firearms? You see how easy this is? Tinfoil hat on.

webster
06-27-2013, 04:38 PM
Yeah, good luck getting those back. Sickening.

Strewth
06-27-2013, 04:43 PM
Bad move. If you say it's about valuables, then what about the paintings on the walls? Why did you take the SKS, and not the cappuccino machine? How is this different then when the owner leaves on vacation?


The guns will be returned to owners after residents are allowed back in town and they provide proof of ownership, Topham added

This could prove difficult with no LGR.

awndray
06-27-2013, 04:44 PM
http://www.fixcas.com/news/2009/redflag.gif

Forbes/Hutton
06-27-2013, 04:46 PM
WOW are you f'ing kidding me?? One flood and they steal all the firearms? You see how easy this is? Tinfoil hat on.

Fixed.

Same goes for a home, if they won't allow me access to MY home then they owe me another one. They are denying people shelter, a fundamental human right as per the UN.

As for breaking into homes, I would be demanding the names of the officers involved and laying an information for Break and Enter, Burglary and Theft against any officer who had been in my home and the minute someone said "just following orders" a charge of Conspiracy to Commit against each officer and the commanders.

I'm sure they'll claim "public safety reasons" but if they are keeping everyone (including the gun's owners) away, who would steal them? Welcome to the police state.

RobSmith
06-27-2013, 04:47 PM
What address as it seized at officer ? Here's proof of address, may I have my property back now ? .... Oh and I'm missing a cappuccino machine, your men wouldn't happen to have seized that too would they ?


Bad move. If you say it's about valuables, then what about the paintings on the walls? Why did you take the SKS, and not the cappuccino machine? How is this different then when the owner leaves on vacation?



This could prove difficult with no LGR.

awndray
06-27-2013, 04:49 PM
Watch them use "exigent circumstances" as an excuse. How would they know that there were firearms in those homes? I'll tell you: registration. Registration leads to confiscation. Seized? No. They were stolen! This is beyond wrong. It's criminal.

This could conceivably be a ruse - an exercise to convince the un-educated public that the LGR is needed in a scenario like this so that firearms can be "returned to their rightful owners". This wreaks of corruption! Returned to their owners with proof of ownership, eh? Well played, thieves. Well played. So much for keeping guns out of the hands of criminals.

There certainly will be hell to pay for this. It looks like more letters need to be written.

coastal
06-27-2013, 04:59 PM
If you read the thread on CGN one of the military guys explained what actually happened. They were searching house to house for injured people, pets left behind, and took only guns that were unlocked and out in the open.

But I wasn't there so I can't be sure which is the truth.

RobSmith
06-27-2013, 05:00 PM
Gotta wonder how the RCMP plans to pay for the damages they would have caused by busting thru some very expensive safes and such while removing firearms ? Or will they just dodge it all by threatening to file "unsafe storage" type charges ?

awndray
06-27-2013, 05:09 PM
If you read the thread on CGN one of the military guys explained what actually happened. They were searching house to house for injured people, pets left behind, and took only guns that were unlocked and out in the open.

But I wasn't there so I can't be sure which is the truth.
That would make for a credible cover-up, if there were any proof to back it up.

blacksmithden
06-27-2013, 05:31 PM
Yeah, good luck getting those back. Sickening.

No kidding. They're trying to tell us that they just broke into peoples homes, took no note of where they stole the property, and now people have to prove that the guns are theirs ? Other than my restricted stuff, I couldn't prove that all of my firearms are mine. Lawsuits need to be filed over this, and who ever gave the ok for this needs to go to prison. Although, it would be entertaining just thinking about a couple of 200lb cops trying to steal my safe....getting a 600lb metal block up my basement steps. I'm pretty sure they would wind up pinned under it when the stairs gave way.

Strewth
06-27-2013, 05:35 PM
Gotta wonder how the RCMP plans to pay for the damages they would have caused by busting thru some very expensive safes and such while removing firearms ? Or will they just dodge it all by threatening to file "unsafe storage" type charges ?

I think the optimist way to look at it is the gun owners moving valuables out of the basement, leaning the firearms against the couch, and then a sudden evac notice....but then my optimism crumbles thinking of the way the RCMP treats other's property, and I also don't get why the burden of proof is on the homeowner; if you had time to remove personal property, you had time to write down the address. If this is a public safety concern regarding looting I sure hope they got all the knives and gasoline and propane bottles and chainsaws and....

OutdoorPursuitsCanada
06-27-2013, 08:08 PM
Not to mention: any proof people may have had of ownership; ie. old registration papers, bills of sale etc - were probably destroyed in the flooding.

newshooter
06-27-2013, 08:27 PM
The Federal Conservative Government has just released the following statement:

"RCMP Seizure of Guns in High River

Media are reporting that the RCMP have seized guns from individuals' homes in the flood affected community of High River, Alberta.

If any firearms were taken, we expect they will be returned to their owners as soon as possible.

We believe the RCMP should focus on more important tasks such as protecting live and private property."

Still sending a contingent of donated arms though.

YukonLeftie
06-27-2013, 08:37 PM
Pro tip - the only good registry is a personal registry. Record your own stuff, keep it safely (bad pun I admit) tucked away. That said, why leave it there for them to find to begin with??

Strewth
06-27-2013, 08:51 PM
Pro tip - the only good registry is a personal registry. Record your own stuff, keep it safely (bad pun I admit) tucked away. That said, why leave it there for them to find to begin with??

Keep it on a portable hard drive with a "hidden" memory, I've heard you can even buy one with dual secret squirrel spots, one to give in to after mild torture by the industrial espionage ninjas, one to stay hidden. Memory sticks/cards are cheap to spread around to parents/kids/trusted farm animal stalls...

Edenchef
06-27-2013, 08:59 PM
Very scary....a very localized SHTF scenario and the first action the RCMP takes is to disarm the local citizens.......Hmmmm. Well they certainly "maintained the right" to be the only ones with arms in the area.

Nice warm fuzzy statement from the CPC: I'll wait to see the action that backs that talk up. Very politically correct, lots of wiggle out room. We must not allow them to wiggle out of this one!!! We need to force a major spanking of the upper level RCMP. Get ready to write; with summer recess,go......talk to your MP.

Question.....did they just stockpile the guns or the ammo too.............

Curious......Cheers!

Asphalt Cowboy
06-27-2013, 09:11 PM
looks like "Operation Cloak and Dagger" is in full force ... no looking back now ... first trial run a pure success.

YukonLeftie
06-27-2013, 09:22 PM
Keep it on a portable hard drive with a "hidden" memory, I've heard you can even buy one with dual secret squirrel spots, one to give in to after mild torture by the industrial espionage ninjas, one to stay hidden. Memory sticks/cards are cheap to spread around to parents/kids/trusted farm animal stalls...

Feeeecccckkk NO! keep it recorded old school. A small fire/waterproof suitcase-style safe that also goes with you. Never record such #s anyplace that could potentially be hacked - or wiped out.

RobSmith
06-27-2013, 09:45 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lxr1oN4rzEM&feature=youtu.be

Apparently this is "official" footage taken during one of those searches.

exmilitary
06-27-2013, 09:50 PM
If you use a Google oriented device, any photos you take get synced to your account in the cloud. Most of the photos I've taken contain serial numbers, including firearms. Wonderful feature, until the magic cloud dissipates.

"Whiskey Tango Foxtrot"
Pro Patria

Rory McCanuck
06-27-2013, 10:45 PM
So, now there are a bunch of houses with smashed in doors just waiting for the looters?

What are the chances of the RCMPs being charged with firearm offenses, like theft and improper storage/ transport?

coastal
06-27-2013, 11:57 PM
Here's an interesting one from a guy on another forum;


"Gun theft is one thing, poloice are there to protect the people...

Gestappo are there to protect themselves.


I have a good friend who has a flooded house, its a 2 story home, the water level is about 4 feet deep in his basement. the upper levels are fine.

They broke down his front door and smashed the side window glass to gain entry, they went upstairs to his master bedroom, smashed through a locked closet door and removed a 24"x36"x60" gun safe weighing about 500 lbs and they removed from his basement another safe with bullets and re-loading equipment from atop his loading table.


They cut into his safe, damaged 3 shotguns and are holding them until he can claim them from a pile of guns...


The best part - he has it all on camera as his place has battery backup for security.




The cops cannot, under any circumstance, seize personal goods unless there is a crime present or a warrant is issued and an arrest warrant accompanied. That's it.



Natural disasters do not take precedence of seizure of personal goods. The fear of looting does not allow it either. Marshal law does really not exist in Canada so shooting looters is not allowed either. They have the right to search for bodies, gas leaks, and those that are not following the evacuation order."

Strewth
06-28-2013, 01:24 AM
^Whoah. That's quite the escalated accusation. Which board? It's not on CGN or Gunslingers?

JimRowell
06-28-2013, 05:28 AM
Here's an interesting one from a guy on another forum;

They broke down his front door and smashed the side window glass to gain entry, they went upstairs to his master bedroom, smashed through a locked closet door and removed a 24"x36"x60" gun safe weighing about 500 lbs and they removed from his basement another safe with bullets and re-loading equipment from atop his loading table.


They cut into his safe, damaged 3 shotguns and are holding them until he can claim them from a pile of guns...


Ok, just whoa for a minute. Tin foil hats off!
We need more time to pass and more info to come out. So far we have an account from a soldier that suggests it was done in a reasonable manner and that may or may not be true. And we have another account that suggests they were out with torches and cranes hauling out safes and cutting them open. I find it close to unbelievable that police and soldiers wading around in water expecting to find bodies would be hauling 500 pound safes out of basements. I mean really? And they prolly found Hoffa and shot some space aliens too. The police have some explaining to do, no doubt, but let's see where it goes before we swallow every loony claim made.

They were following emergency orders and probably have a legal responsibility to secure any firearms found improperly stored. They may have gone overboard or they may have acted well. The law that allows the orders may need changing or not. We need more good info and all we have is hearsay from anonymous sources.

Not saying this whole thing isn't VERY concerning; it is. But let's not go wacko too soon.

newshooter
06-28-2013, 07:27 AM
I might be headed down there for a protest today. I suggest any members of GOC from High River go the RCMP office and provide proof like they said and try get your gun back ASAP. Report back to us and we will act accordingly.

coastal
06-28-2013, 07:40 AM
^Whoah. That's quite the escalated accusation. Which board? It's not on CGN or Gunslingers?


Nope an off road related forum. The guy that posted it is a pretty reputable source that knows a lot of people in person on the forum. Whether it's true or not we won't know until that video surfaces. But he said it's not surfacing until after the lawsuit is finished with.

newshooter
06-28-2013, 09:28 AM
Harper spokesman says he government expects High River guns to be returned quickly


By The Canadian Press June 28, 2013 9:23 AM

[Pin It]
0


OTTAWA - The Prime Minister's Office is wading into a dispute between residents of flood-ravaged High River and the RCMP over the seizure of firearms from homes in the evacuated Alberta town.

The Mounties said Thursday they had seized guns from homes in the flood zone, and put them in a safe place.

That angered residents of the town, who have been anxious to return to their homes to assess the flood damage.

A spokesman for Prime Minister Stephen Harper says the government expects the guns to be returned quickly.

Press secretary Carl Vallee adds that the Mounties should be dealing with more important things, such as protecting lives.

And evacuation order for the town of about 13,000 residents is now into its ninth day.

Read more: http://www.calgaryherald.com/story.html?id=8592786#ixzz2XWcBjuE2

OldDirtyGatMasta
06-28-2013, 10:17 AM
Ok, just whoa for a minute. Tin foil hats off!
We need more time to pass and more info to come out. So far we have an account from a soldier that suggests it was done in a reasonable manner and that may or may not be true. And we have another account that suggests they were out with torches and cranes hauling out safes and cutting them open. I find it close to unbelievable that police and soldiers wading around in water expecting to find bodies would be hauling 500 pound safes out of basements. I mean really? And they prolly found Hoffa and shot some space aliens too. The police have some explaining to do, no doubt, but let's see where it goes before we swallow every loony claim made.



What do you know about the aliens? Seriously, we need to find out who's leaking this stuff lol.

Anyway more to the point, I agree. What exact equipment did they have at their disposal to either open or remove safes? Carrying heavy safes and lockers around would present a danger to those involved while in water logged house-holds that might have damaged floors and the time involved would be far to great to make any sense. I'm gonna wait and see what proof surfaces around these cases.

newshooter
06-28-2013, 10:48 AM
Can we get video confirmation of a gun cabinet being cut opened?

Edenchef
06-28-2013, 01:33 PM
If there is.......someone (RCMP) needs to go directly to jail!!!

coastal
06-28-2013, 01:36 PM
As I mentioned, he apparently said this particular video will not be released until he is through whatever lawsuit he has planned.

Prairie Dog
06-28-2013, 02:45 PM
Reading on the AO forum:


My SIL called an hour ago and I find out my brother is in custody in clagary for firearms charges from high river. This is what his wife tell me. They took him from work. He is a machine operator removing flood debris. My uncle is criminal defense attorney. What can I do?

http://www.outdoorsmenforum.ca/showthread.php?p=2021974#post2021974 (post 311)

Can not and will not speak to its validity.

newshooter
06-28-2013, 03:57 PM
The province needs to dispatch the provincial sheriffs to take control of High River and get the RCMP out of there because they are out of control. Today they fined a volunteer for driving with a chipped windshield. The RCMP cannot be trusted to restore law & order.

coastal
06-28-2013, 04:12 PM
Can we get video confirmation of the alleged rock chip ticket? :P

They actually pulled him over? WTF?

Prairie Dog
06-28-2013, 04:59 PM
Solomon Friedman @ about the 12:00 mark:

http://www.sunnewsnetwork.ca/video/liberty-under-siege/2516148516001

newshooter
06-28-2013, 05:11 PM
Focus on More Important Tasks
June 28th, 2013

CALGARY - Rob Anders, MP for Calgary-West expects that “any firearms taken will be returned to their owners as soon as possible.”

Mr. Anders said, “The RCMP should focus on more important tasks such as protecting lives and private property.”

This flooding and subsequent evacuation was a highly unusual incident. MP Rob Anders reaffirmed Minister Toews statement that operational matters for the RCMP in High River are under local control and were not directed by the federal government.

“Police should be seen defending private property not depriving private property”, said Anders. “The province of Alberta should perhaps consider a provincial police force.”
-30-

Edenchef
06-28-2013, 06:21 PM
Focus on More Important Tasks
June 28th, 2013

CALGARY - Rob Anders, MP for Calgary-West expects that “any firearms taken will be returned to their owners as soon as possible.”

Mr. Anders said, “The RCMP should focus on more important tasks such as protecting lives and private property.”

This flooding and subsequent evacuation was a highly unusual incident. MP Rob Anders reaffirmed Minister Toews statement that operational matters for the RCMP in High River are under local control and were not directed by the federal government.

“Police should be seen defending private property not depriving private property”, said Anders. “The province of Alberta should perhaps consider a provincial police force.”
-30-

So.... the solution is another police force; nursing on the public nipple. Under Allison Ratfords control. WTF is he smoking!!!!

Cheers!

RELOAD
06-28-2013, 07:04 PM
this is why i kept ALL MY REGISTRATION CERTIFICATES.

Right Edition
06-28-2013, 08:20 PM
So if the RCMP only "seized" the guns that were left unlocked and out in the open, can we expect the next RCMP media release to be a report of the list of charges laid against those homeowners? On top of losing everything to the floods, they'll be faced with defending themselves in court.

killer kane
06-29-2013, 02:46 PM
I like the idea of a provincial police force. The queen of the u.n. will be gone soon. so we'd be safer than with the yellow legs. Of course we'd have to make sure no eps traffic snuck in.

blacksmithden
06-29-2013, 10:17 PM
I like the idea of a provincial police force. The queen of the u.n. will be gone soon. so we'd be safer than with the yellow legs. Of course we'd have to make sure no eps traffic snuck in.

Ummmm.....yea....ask Ontario gun owners how the Ontario Provincial Police have worked out for them. This name ring a bell ? Chris Whyatt ? Yea...this new level of idiot is proudly brought to you by the OPP.

RobSmith
06-29-2013, 10:32 PM
Oh heck the OPP are relatively docile compared to the SQ ...


Ummmm.....yea....ask Ontario gun owners how the Ontario Provincial Police have worked out for them. This name ring a bell ? Chris Whyatt ? Yea...this new level of idiot is proudly brought to you by the OPP.

newshooter
07-03-2013, 10:26 AM
Let's do our best to propagandize the High River incident so we can push for the final gutting of C-68 when Parliament returns in the Fall.