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  1. #31
    Senior Member Battle Beaver's Avatar
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    I thought this sounded familiar....

    "Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves." - William Pitt the Younger (speech in the House of Commons 1783)

    Paradise Lost (1667) John Milton:
    "And with necessity, / The tyrant's plea, / excus'd his devilish deeds."
    http://www.youtube.com/battlebeaver
    ** Member CSSA, NSSF and NRA ** Why aren't you?

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  3. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Battle Beaver View Post
    I thought this sounded familiar....

    "Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves." - William Pitt the Younger (speech in the House of Commons 1783)

    Paradise Lost (1667) John Milton:
    "And with necessity, / The tyrant's plea, / excus'd his devilish deeds."
    If not already there, it should be added to the "Philosophical and profound quotes by anyone." section.
    We were told he wasn't ready, now we know he will never be!
    Rewarding 4 years of incompetence and corruption with 4 more years, says a lot about our electorate.

  4. #33
    Senior Member CLW .45's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 3MTA3 View Post
    So if I understand you correctly, your strategy is to fire politicians by convincing the majority of the non- firearm owning public that they need guns to protect themselves thus removing support from the gun grabbing politicians?


    " Overall, half of Americans say gun violence is a very big problem in the United States, but perceptions of gun violence vary considerably by gun ownership. While six-in-ten non-gun owners (59%) see gun violence as a very big problem in the country today, only a third of adults who own guns say the same.

    Americans see many factors as playing a role in gun violence. Among all adults, 86% say the ease with which people can illegally obtain guns contributes a great deal or a fair amount to gun violence; 60% point to the ease with which people can legally obtain guns. And while similarly high shares of gun owners and non-owners cite illegal access to guns as a major contributor to gun violence, opinions diverge when it comes to guns that are obtained legally. Two-thirds of non-gun owners (67%) see this as a contributing factor to gun violence, compared with fewer than half (44%) of gun owners.


    I suspect in Canada the numbers would be skewed toward anti-gun.

    69% of Canadians support outright ban on guns in urban areas: poll
    https://globalnews.ca/news/3894223/c...ight-ban-guns/

    Your understanding of my tactics is incorrect.

    My estimate, based on my experience, is that each of the 2 million plus licenced owners interacts with 2 non owners who have an interest in owning a handgun for protection.

    A significant number of them are interested in carrying.

    And, just as the majority of people are urban, the majority of those I have encountered are urban.

    My estimate of an average of 2 per owner is based on the 20 or so that I have encountered in the past decade.

    What those people need to hear, because they are unaware of it, is that the law provides for use, carriage, and possession of handguns to protect life.

    The other thing is that the firearms owning community is advocating for removal of the barriers to access for them.

    It is not about convincing them of anything, they just need to hear the facts.

    Now, as to the politicians.

    As a percentage of the voting population, firearms owners donít appear particularly significant.

    However, 2 million is a very significant voting block if they get together with significant demands.

    That 4.5 million block doesnít need to be convinced that the law needs to support them, they already believe it.

    For any portion of them to join in the advocacy, they just need to believe that their efforts will not be wasted.

    The remainder of the population is split between a very small group of antis who are active, and a very large group who either donít care one way or the other or donít have strong enough feelings to bother with it.

    We must understand that the active antis have grown in numbers over the past 40 years, and that will continue.

    Whether their numbers will ever be significant is questionable.

    But, between the possibility that they will, and the advanced stage of the disarmament agenda, we really do need to get off the stick.

    The priority is to educate our fellow owners, while telling every politician that we require repeal, repeal, and more repeal.

    Some time ago, I expressed that as speaking to government with one clear voice.

    Unfortunately, many have continued with the nearly half century long practice of arguing against the ďflavour of the dayĒ ban on the basis that it targets the wrong people, targets guns that arenít a problem, and generally pisses us off.

    Well, that gun-grabber sees us as the wrong people to have guns, armed thugs are not a priority for him.

    He sees no difference between the targeted guns, despite characterizing those as especially problematical guns, because he plans to ban every one of them.

    And he has no problem with pissing us off, because he sees us as ineffectual, with good reason.

    I see indications that we can do it, so I keep on, even though it sometimes seems that I am wasting my time.

    Does this answer your question?
    To show that men can travel to the moon and return, use the American experience.

    To show that public safety isnít hurt by responsible individuals carrying to protect life, use the American experience.

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  6. #34
    Senior Member 3MTA3's Avatar
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    I think I understand to some degree and agree for the most part, although i am quite a bit more pessimistic with respect to numbers.
    When I argue with "non-pro-gun, yet not full anti-gun" types- I generally ask them if -" if you were to possess a handgun or other scary gun, would it cause you to be likely to harm someone else?" This often times causes them to consider that so called "gun crime" has little to do with guns, but a great deal to do with who has the gun, however, they often tend to cling to the belief that disarming everyone is a logical and likely effective solution.
    I work hard at educating even my fellow gun-owners and am always surprised (why?) when I encounter FUDDS ,handgun guys who think AR's should be banned, or hunters who think they are not a target of the Liberals. I believe like Doug_M that truly engaged gun owner numbers are small- I hope they are waking up to the Liberal BS.
    "So much of left-wing thought is a kind of playing with fire by people who don't even know that fire is hot.." - George Orwell
    "Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves."-William Pitt the younger
    FTrudeau

  7. #35
    Senior Member CLW .45's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 3MTA3 View Post
    I think I understand to some degree and agree for the most part, although i am quite a bit more pessimistic with respect to numbers.
    When I argue with "non-pro-gun, yet not full anti-gun" types- I generally ask them if -" if you were to possess a handgun or other scary gun, would it cause you to be likely to harm someone else?" This often times causes them to consider that so called "gun crime" has little to do with guns, but a great deal to do with who has the gun, however, they often tend to cling to the belief that disarming everyone is a logical and likely effective solution.
    I work hard at educating even my fellow gun-owners and am always surprised (why?) when I encounter FUDDS ,handgun guys who think AR's should be banned, or hunters who think they are not a target of the Liberals. I believe like Doug_M that truly engaged gun owner numbers are small- I hope they are waking up to the Liberal BS.

    That’s why I just don’t bother with non gun-owning antis.

    I run into enough of the gun-owning kind.
    To show that men can travel to the moon and return, use the American experience.

    To show that public safety isnít hurt by responsible individuals carrying to protect life, use the American experience.

  8. #36
    Senior Member Gunexpert007's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mobusten View Post
    Has anyone ever actually seen a non gun owner lay eyes on an issue of Calibre magazine?
    Very doubtful if the anti gun community reads , or ever sees , Calibre magazine . I suspect that most of the anti gun folks and the Canadian Govt. get their information from CGN , GOC , and American news channel stories about mass shootings in the U.S. .
    " Better To Fight For Something , Than Live For Nothing " ; " When In Doubt....ATTACK ".......Gen. George S. Patton Jr.

  9. #37
    SeŮor Member Dewey Cox's Avatar
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    Just got the mail.
    The most offensive part of this issue for me is the cssa fundraiser raffle.
    A turkish shot gun? Come on guys...
    Why does the rest of the country get first dibbs on half my income?

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  11. #38
    Calibre Magazine Calibre's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Strangeday View Post
    It’s absolutely stunning how wildly politically tone deaf the current issue is. Whatever brain trust is running that show needs to take a beat and clue in
    Ok, boomer.

    Just so we're clear, you would prefer it if the most widely read gun publication in the country, what... proactively responded to JT's gun ban by banning "assault weapons" from our pages? Never mind that 200k gun owners read it, we should bend our editorial will to those that would prefer we not exist at all?


    Nah, fuck that.
    Last edited by Calibre; 12-31-2019 at 10:30 PM.
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