Time taken to issue club level ATT?

[3MTA3]

Sure OK-This is not done by most clubs , just so they can push more paper and volunteer more hours or suffer abuse by members- It is done by request of the Ontario CFO-
Go try to get an ATT in Ontario with out belonging to a club or taking the so called "ATT" Course. The CFO has made this a requirement of clubs in ON. Is it Possible to get without a club membership and course?- Yes ;-Easy?-

Definitely not.

THREAT TO SAFETY MENACE À LA SÉCURITÉ
1.1 A chief firearms officer may issue to an individual
an authorization to transport if the chief firearms officer
determines that the transportation of a restricted
firearm or prohibited firearm, as the case may be, between
two or more specified places will not pose a threat
to the safety of the individual or any other individual

I guess this one way they try to ensure this- rightly or wrongly.

[3MTA3]

Also- there is regulation that requires safety training for range use;

7. (1) The operator of a shooting range shall ensure
that every person who indicates an intention to use the
shooting range for the first time is informed of the safety
rules used at that shooting range.



(2) No person may use a shooting range for the first
time without having received the information referred to
in subsection (1).

This can be simple or more involved but it required whether a ATT is needed or not.

Also;

5. The operator of an approved shooting range shall
ensure that the discharge of firearms on the shooting
range does not endanger the safety of persons at the
shooting range or in the portion of the surrounding area
described in paragraph 3(2)(a), by taking appropriate
measures, including ensuring that
(a) the design and operation of the shooting range


(i) is such that projectiles discharged from firearms
will not leave the shooting range if they are discharged
there in accordance with the safety rules,
and
(ii) promotes the safety of all persons on the shooting
range, including by accommodating any adaptation
that may be appropriate given the nature of the
shooting activities that may take place and the type
and calibre of firearms that may be used there;

[Shalimar]

CFO's have imposed a minimum 2 week waiting period for first time ATT's in Alberta I know.

Proof? If someone at the CFO's office said that demand it in writing!!!

Why? Simple.. they legally cannot do that since that would be in direct violation of the law and no. the CFO's cannot use "discretion" to add that sort of condition.

[Shalimar]

Alberta processed 13000 new not renewed pal/rpal in the first 1/4 of this year and i was told it was looking the same for the second 1/4. Thinks that speed this up. Long membership standing, restricted owner, competitive shooter, which usually shows the above. Stop bitching about wait times i would just as soon see 20000 new card holders and wait an extra month cause that means more votes for us at election time and a bigger voice to make changes. Hope you get your latt soon.
Desiel

No offense.. but start bitching more.. only to your MP. Parliament intended the system to be quick by their own words and the letter of the law. Therefore delays on that which should have never existed in the first place are unacceptable regardless of how many card holders there are.

And new card holders are a good thing esp if they listen, learn and get into the fight.

[Shalimar]

Some shooting clubs or ranges have introduced "probationary" club memberships. These temporary memberships are designed for potential club or range members who are new to the club or previous members who have not actively used the range for a specified period of time (i.e., 2-3 years). The terms and conditions of these memberships (such as duration and attendance at range safety seminars) are established and monitored by the shooting club or range. For the purposes of the issuance of a long-term ATT for target practice, CFO's generally require that the ATT applicant has a "full" club membership (i.e., has met the terms and conditions of the probationary membership and has been issued a subsequent "full" club or range membership).
<http://www.rcmp-grc.gc.ca/cfp-pcaf/fs-fd/target_cible-eng.htm>

The CFOs cannot by law demand any membership and that they have been forced to admit in court more than once. Any refusal on that basis MUST by law be done in writing.. they cannot refuse in any other manner as per the FA

[Shalimar]

Sure OK-This is not done by most clubs , just so they can push more paper and volunteer more hours or suffer abuse by members- It is done by request of the Ontario CFO-
Go try to get an ATT in Ontario with out belonging to a club or taking the so called "ATT" Course. The CFO has made this a requirement of clubs in ON. Is it Possible to get without a club membership and course?- Yes ;-Easy?-

Definitely not.

I guess this one way they try to ensure this- rightly or wrongly.

I and others like Cyclone have.. why do you think there was court cases and we WON...

The CFO cannot make it a requirement since there is no basis in law for them to try to do such. Again this has been done in court and wyatt has had to eat his own words on the stand more than once.

Also now with all the attention over this Blaney is acting.. not enough IMHO.. but he is at least getting off his ass and ATTs soon will be removed from the CFOs entirely.

[Shalimar]

Also- there is regulation that requires safety training for range use;

True,.. but the actual course is at the discretion of the club not the CFO. Hence why the club can exempt anyone they wish and the CFO cannot say squat about it. (Trust me I've done it)

This can be simple or more involved but it required whether a ATT is needed or not.

Also;

very true and it does vary depending on the club.. but IMO that is how it should be.. the club is whom you deal with and it is up to them and/or their BOD to decide what they want for a course etc etc. No idiotic oversight by the CFO ever needed

[3MTA3]

Well actually the course is specified by the CFO' office-

..Successfully completed a club level handgun safety course that meets the minimum training and testing standards prescribed in the CSSA, CFI ,CQB or equivalent club level safety course. All have shown a responsible attitude and behavior towards the care, handling and use of firearms and are hereby recommended by the executive of said club to have their authorizations to transport issued..

-From the form submitted by clubs to the ministry

[Shalimar]

Well actually the course is specified by the CFO' office-

-From the form submitted by clubs to the ministry

The CFO's can quote that til the cows come home.. but it is not law. Hence why there is no cohesive course (nor should there be if any CFO/CFC is in charge).. it is upto the particular club what they decide is what they want.

As for the CSSA, CFI, CQB etc,.. all courses are different and again shows how there is no "law" in this regards.. much to the dismay of wyatt and his ilk whom continue to spread myths and lies in this regard.


Also of note.. " are hereby recommended by the executive of said club to have their authorizations to transport issued.."

This has nothing in law to back it up since an ATT has to do with transport laws not use laws and they are mutually exclusive and cannot nor should not be confused (as per established legal prescient)

Once again more myths and lies that sadly are all too commonly spread and even more sadly believed.

[Billythreefeathers]

Here's hoping that the ATT dies a quick death as part of the new licensing laws.

Absolutely no need for an extra piece of paper nor any of the extra BS from the CFO office.

[3MTA3]

Authorizations to
Transport Restricted
Firearms and Prohibited
Firearms Regulations

SOR/98-206

ATT's are covered by a specific regulation, not the Storage display and transport regs.

Hey, like I said-Go try to get an ATT in Ontario with out belonging to a club or taking the so called "ATT" Course. The CFO has made this a requirement of clubs in ON. Is it Possible to get without a club membership and course?- Yes
;-Easy?-Definitely not.
The courses were put in place by the former OHA I believe, so gun-owners are in fact partially responsible if that is indeed the case.
For the average Joe or Joeline this is the way it works, and not too many clubs are going to buck it, or they may risk closer scrutiny.

[3MTA3]

Here's hoping that the ATT dies a quick death as part of the new licensing laws.

Absolutely no need for an extra piece of paper nor any of the extra BS from the CFO office.

From what I understand, the ATT will not be going away, it may just be mererly taking the form of a condition attached to a license- but I am not sure, maybe someone else has some comments regarding this? I believe the law is set up this way already;

3. An authorization to transport that takes the form of
a condition attached to a licence must
(a) identify all of the firearms to which the authorization
to transport applies; and
(b) specify
(i) the period for which the authorization to transport
is issued,
(ii) the places between which the firearms to which
it applies may be transported, and
(iii) the reasons for which the firearms may be
transported between the specified places.

[Shalimar]

Authorizations to
Transport Restricted
Firearms and Prohibited
Firearms Regulations

SOR/98-206

ATT's are covered by a specific regulation, not the Storage display and transport regs.

Hey, like I said-Go try to get an ATT in Ontario with out belonging to a club or taking the so called "ATT" Course. The CFO has made this a requirement of clubs in ON. Is it Possible to get without a club membership and course?- Yes
;-Easy?-Definitely not.
The courses were put in place by the former OHA I believe, so gun-owners are in fact partially responsible if that is indeed the case.
For the average Joe or Joeline this is the way it works, and not too many clubs are going to buck it, or they may risk closer scrutiny.

Very true... but bear in mind that the only way it will get to be easy instead of the CFO's ever tightening BS is by people doing as I and a few others have and fight back.. do not do so is in essence helping the CFOs

[Shalimar]

From what I understand, the ATT will not be going away, it may just be mererly taking the form of a condition attached to a license- but I am not sure, maybe someone else has some comments regarding this? I believe the law is set up this way already;

Same here.. though we have not seen any of the proposed legislation yet. Therefore before it's drafted we must ALL speak up and demand it be eliminated 100000% since it does absolutely zero good and is constantly abused by the CFOs to persecute those whom have done nothing wrong. It should never have existed in the first place.

[riderrick]

so is it a club rule or cfo rule, the club applying for the att? here in bc I just faxed proof of membership to the cfo to get my att. not that I liked having to prove it but I needed membership to shoot so what the heck....it is the only place to shoot in my area.